Nossiter's "Liquid Memory"

SFJoe

Joe Dougherty
Jonathan Nossiter's book is now out in English. Mikey didn't like at Slate.

I haven't read it, but the review seems all too plausible.

Any dissents from folks who've actually seen it?
 
originally posted by SFJoe:
Nossiter's "Liquid Memory"Jonathan Nossiter's book is now out in English. Mikey didn't like at Slate.

I haven't read it, but the review seems all too plausible.

Any dissents from folks who've actually seen it?

You forgot to mention the Nossiter/VS smackdown mentioned by Mr. Steingarten. (I'm looking forward to reading the book review in Elmundovino) I can't say that, on the basis of my experience with 'Mondovino,' I'm going to run out and buy his book. Rather, I'm putting Mikey's "Au Revoir to all that" toward the top of the list of books to buy/beg for.

Mark Lipton
 
I like Nossiter's basic premise (natural wine = good) but the way he imparts it is so one-sided and heavy handed that I felt compelled to join the Barefoot Cellars Mag o' the Month Club a couple of chapters in. This is one time with I do want to kill the messenger. The guy needs to borrow a sense of humor the next time he sets out to write a book or make a movie. He's no Keith Olbermann (or even Neal Rosenthal, for that matter).

But Steinberger's book is quite good, although the question remains as to whether anyone (ie: teeming masses) this side of Sharon really cares much about the state of French cuisine these days.

-Eden (whattya wanna bet that Nossiter drives a Prius when he's not riding his donkey to work?)
 
originally posted by Eden Mylunsch:
... the question remains as to whether anyone (ie: teeming masses) this side of Sharon really cares much about the state of French cuisine these days.

Ooh, settin' the bar pretty low, there! Who could possibly limbo under that pole?

All right, I sometimes eat out. But you misoverestimate my general rampant restaurant foodiness.
 
originally posted by Rahsaan:
originally posted by Eden Mylunsch:

Eden (whattya wanna bet that Nossiter drives a Prius when he's not riding his donkey to work?)

Do they sell many Priuses in Paris?

Hopefully they don't sell too many donkeys. I heard they are terrible for one's carbon footprint. Unless you get a hybrid, like a mule.
 
Do they sell many Priuses in Paris?
We've seen a few hybrids. Don't recall the make. Mostly, the part of the city we're in is devoid of traffic, which to my mind is a good thing.
 
originally posted by SFJoe:
Nossiter's "Liquid Memory"Jonathan Nossiter's book is now out in English. Mikey didn't like at Slate.

I haven't read it, but the review seems all too plausible.

Any dissents from folks who've actually seen it?

Most of the people opining elsewhere haven't read it either but that hasn't stopped pages and pages of iridescent guff. It seems as though Nossiter's style provokes a similar response - a bit like the Mondovino threads.

Nevertheless Steinberger really didn't like it but it seemed more visceral than that so maybe he just doesn't like Nossiter - perhaps like his aversion to Sauvignon Blanc. OTOH the NYT review was much kinder with just enough reservations [maybe] to avoid being pilloried.
 
Anyone know the relation of this new book to the French Gout et pouvoir? Is it just a translation?
 
I usually love Steinberger's stuff, but I love Nossiter's stuff too. Plenty of Steinberger's criticisms are valid, especially the bit about its humorlessness - the book would have benefited from some levity, and it's odd that it's absent considering the book is mostly a narrative of people drinking wine, which usually leads to laughs and revelry. But, geez, if I had my druthers, Sarah Palin would be president and Ann Coulter would be Secretary of Defense, so if Nossiter's constant left-wing stink bombs don't ruin MY enjoyment of this book, they shouldn't pose a problem for anyone else, either.

The book is basically about how all the little discussions and debates we have about wine are microcosms for all those discussions and debates people have about Bigger Issues... and for him, a lot of those issues are political. (That's fine, because it's also a personal book, and if his politics are a big part of his thinking they are going to be a big part of this story.) If he thinks good wine is fundamentally leftist, you're free to make the opposite case (as I've done before) and you're free to argue that winemaking philosophy has no political content at all, but at the end of the day at least you've had the discussion, and that's what Nossiter is trying to accomplish. I think he pulls it off well.

The book is also about his attempt to come up with some language for talking about wine more meaningful than the tasting-note genre, and his frustration with the difficulty of doing so. That frustration makes him come off like a bit of a dickhead in a few scenes - even in his own account of the proceedings! - but he stays consistently insightful. Anybody who enjoys talking about talking about wine should read the book.
 
originally posted by Sharon Bowman:

Ooh, settin' the bar pretty low, there! Who could possibly limbo under that pole?

All right, I sometimes eat out. But you misoverestimate my general rampant restaurant foodiness.

Sharon plays the "aw, shucks!" card.
 
originally posted by Cliff:
Anyone know the relation of this new book to the French Gout et pouvoir? Is it just a translation?

It seems like it is a translation. I don't know if they added any new material but I enjoyed the French version of this a few years ago (and even posted about it on Therapy) but in a casual, non-insightful, airplane-reading type of way. In fact, I read it on an airplane.

I mean for folks like us who spend so much time talking about wine and thinking about wine, his insights are not going to seem particularly insightful. That doesn't mean we won't enjoy the porn of him having dinner with winemakers and drinking fun stuff. But the 'deepness' of the thoughts seem more directly aimed at people who haven't spent as much time thinking about the issues of power and taste and how that relates to wine.

Still, nice to see all the tempers flaring again. I guess.
 
originally posted by Keith Levenberg:
But, geez, if I had my druthers, Sarah Palin would be president and Ann Coulter would be Secretary of Defense...

Um, President of What? And, don't you mean Secretary of Offense?
 
originally posted by Jack Everitt:
originally posted by Keith Levenberg:
But, geez, if I had my druthers, Sarah Palin would be president...

Um, President of What?

I was also confused by this.

I knew Keith tilted right wing but I assumed there was a better figurehead for his ideas than Sarah Palin!
 
originally posted by MLipton:
(I'm looking forward to reading the book review in Elmundovino)
Fundamentalist Catholic neocons that we are, Mark, we won't review it. Actually, it's because we already reviewed the French edition, 'Le got et le pouvoir', two years ago. Our review then was just a translation of an article by Michel Bettane, which at the time I found pretty scathing (and, let's face it, also representative of my own feelings, scurrilous huckster that I am.) However, Michel now seems like a Nossiter enthusiast in comparison with Mike's truly devastating review...
 
I just don't see that.

I liked Mondovino precisely because Nossiter wasn't Michael Moore. He didn't inject himself into the proceedings overly much. His style of interview wasn't some outlandish, provocative theater designed to put his ideological opponents off-balance from the start.

The interviewees in Mondovino seemed very content with themselves and the scope of the topics discussed. None had the deer-in-the-headlights look of a "participant" in a Michael Moore interview.
I'm sure Nossiter had a slate of topics he wanted to discuss. And I've been told (and could easily imagine) that some nuance was left on the editing room floor, comments that would provide less clear-cut delineation in the on-going battle.
But the comparison to Moore seems absurd.

I don't "get" some of Steinberger's other points as well.
The penses that he complains about hardly originated with Nossiter; they're pretty much boilerplate sound bites from the winemaker's dinner circuit.

If other developments are as Steinberger paints them, though, I guess I won't be a fan of the book.
A tiresome obsession with overtly political subjects, personal attacks as a way of settling scores, mistakenly placing himself in the spotlight.... none of these strike me as particularly promising ways for Nossiter to go.

I'll buy the book, but maybe I'll wait until I find it heavily discounted.
 
originally posted by Bruce G.:
I liked Mondovino precisely because Nossiter wasn't Michael Moore. He didn't inject himself into the proceedings overly much. His style of interview wasn't some outlandish, provocative theater designed to put his ideological opponents off-balance from the start.

I could not disagree more strenuously.
 
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