Anyone try the 2009 Willi Schaefer's yet?

Y

Yule Kim

Yule Kim
I was thinking of buying some pre-arrival Willi Schaefers. I'm looking at the Graacher Himmelreich and Graacher Domprobst Kabinetts and the Graacher Domprobst Spatleses #5 and #10 and the Graacher Himmelreich Spatlese.

Is 2009 more of a kabinett vintage or spatlese vintage for Schaefer? Does Schaefer have better vines in Domprobst or Himmelreich? And what is the difference between spatlese #5 and #10?
 
Tried Himmelreich Kabinett Tuesday & it was rather etched and somewhat austere. I liked it.

The Gracher Domprobst Spatlese #10 was very good in classic Schaefer style (not too sweet - very mineral driven). #5 was not available to taste.
 
I'm feeling tempted by these, too. Austere Kabinett is the best kind. JG seems to approve of the Schaefers, FWIW. Also considering some Donnhoff.
 
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
I'm feeling tempted by these, too. Austere Kabinett is the best kind. JG seems to approve of the Schaefers, FWIW. Also considering some Donnhoff.
Click to expand...

'09 Hermannshhle was ethereal. Big ups . . .

I've heard Lieser was the star of the Middle Mosel in 2009.
 
Buy them all, hard to see how you'll go wrong. Differences mostly end up just being personal preference related.

AFAIK, there is not a huge difference between the Domprobst and the Himmelreich and I'm not sure if Schaefer has 'better' vines in either. In theory, the Himmelreich is more flowery and forward while the Domprobst is earthier and deeper and potentially backwards. But by the time you add all the pradikat and cuvee level variation, it's hard to have clean rules.

As a reward for all this complicated stuff, the wines are usually really good so you won't go wrong. Don't worry.
 
I think Domprobst is supposed to be a titch better than Himmelreich, but agree that you can't go wrong with some of each - probably what I'll end up doing.
 
originally posted by Salil Benegal:
originally posted by Lyle Fass:
'09 Hermannshhle was ethereal. Big ups . . .
Click to expand...
Indeed. I really liked Schneider's Hermannshhle wines as well. The Sptlese, Auslese Junior and Eiswein were all fantastic.
Click to expand...

I'm going old school on this but...shhhhhhhh..........as was Magnus Hermannshhle Spatlese Trocken which should be a GG but isn't. Not sure if he is in the VDP.
 
originally posted by David M. Bueker:


Never have found Lieser to my liking.
Click to expand...

I am touch and go. I really prefer them with moderate age. An '07 Kabinett from Juffer-Sonnenuhr a couple weeks ago was flat-out great. Ooh Aah Kabinett for sure. Young, they are funky (natural yeasts), but with age they really come around aromatically and can be just stunning wines. I treat them like Prum and just don't touch them, but my window of not touching them is much shorter than Prum. I'll go 3-7 years on the Kabinett, 10-15 on Spatlese. 15-20 on Auslese, and the norm for GK, LGK, BA, etc. I'd love to taste some of the LGKA and GKA from '05 in fifteen years. Astonishing wines those were. I hear he also he made a truly profound GG in 2009. I'll taste it in August.
 
Schneider is not VDP which is why it is not GG. I liked the wine a lot, though I did not find great strength in drier wines Tuesday. There were a few I liked (the Magnus, Selbach's Schmitt Trocken, a Spreitzer EG).
 
IMHO, 2009 is clearly an Auslese vintage. The purity of the fruit combined with the absence of noble rot gave a lot of balance to Ausleses. FYI 2006 Ausleses are at the other end of this spectrum.

I tasted Schaefer's whole line up twice. I got the impression of a little more restrained wines with respect to other producers (the vintage is v easy to read some referred this as hedonistic but I would disagree, I would rather say wines exhibits spectacular balance especially at the Ausleses level).

The Himmelreich as usual is much more fwd vineyard with respect to the Domprobst. If you want immediate satisfaction go for the Kabinett and or Spatlese. If you have a little more patience go for the Auslese #9, it will be a great wine in 5 years.
I found the Domprobst much more mineral/intense/closed then usual moving up the Preadikat. #10 is a more classical version of #5 which usually is a big step up in power and intensity. The Domprobst's Ausleses both #11 and #15 need time and underperformed. However, the #15 had so much compressed layers that lasted 2/3 mins in my mouth. You do need to wait and I have no doubt that at the auctions (when I will go and taste again) they will show so much better.
I am not a huge BA fan but fell for the #17's kalidoscope of emotions I got when the first sip got into my mouth. The saltiness of the vineyard was still there. Impressive. The BA is available only in 100L wordwide so you gotta hurry. Have not tasted the Eiswein, in 50L only it's a family-and-friends kind of wine.

Thanks for listening.

Filo
 
I tried several kabinetts this week that were not at all declassified auslese in style (even if they were in practice).Meulenhof, von Othegraven, Kruger-Rumpf, etc all had some lovely kabinetts. I was very much taken with a 2009 Geil Muskateller Trocken (no pradikat) that even my picky wife enjoyed, so that should tell you something.
 
originally posted by Thor:
IMHO, 2009 is clearly an Auslese vintage.
Click to expand...
So...look for wines labeled kabinett, then? *sigh*
Click to expand...

Let me briefly expand. As said above the vintage gives IMHO the best results with Ausleses. However the quality is so high across the board that lower Praedikat are excellent as well but in relative terms you find better wines as you move higher in the spectrum.

It's the opposite to my taste of the 2006: a very good to excellent vintage with so much noble rot that resulted in too fat/rich Ausleses. Hence I went for Kabinett and Spatleses. But were 2006 Ausleses worse than the 2004/3/2 vintages ? Not really.

In 2007 to me Spatelses stole the show but all the wines across the spectrum were better than their 2006 counterparties, IMHO.

To me Germany's vintages are successfull or not also according to results in each single Praedikat. Often times when a vintage is rich I tend to mover lower in the scale and when the vintage is a little more classic I can handle the higher end as well. 2009 is an exception to me as rich and extremely balanced.

Thor, what did you try so far and what are your thoughts on this vintage and on the relationship between vintage and Praedikat ?

Thanks for listening.

F.
 
Clearly understood Thor, though it was still worth mentioning, as several kabinetts (e.g. Diel) seemed rather large for their trousers so to speak.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top