1er Cru not displayed?

Peter Creasey

Peter Creasey

Peter Creasey
I had a 1er Cru Nuits St Georges this evening that I know is 1er Cru but the bottle makes no mention of it.

Why might a well known Burgundy vintner not display the 1er Cru designation on the bottle label?

. . . . Pete
 
For some vineyards, not all the land is classified as 1er Cru. There are a few such in Vosne - for example, parts of Suchots are not 1er Cru IIRC. I no longer remember if there are any in Nuits. Where is Claude when we need him?
 
Andrew, thanks, that led me to the answer.

After quite a bit of research, I learned that the wine is produced from lieu-dit and 1/2 - 2/3 from the 1er Cru part of the vineyard.

Wine purveyors seem to regularly (always?) advertise the bottling as being 1er Cru.

Interesting (and a bit bothersome)!

. . . . . Pete
 
This begs the question (hopefully the correct usage of this phrase!), what percentage of a wine must be from 1er Cru climat so that it can be advertised as 1er Cru?

I've done a good bit of googling and am unable to find any discussion on this.

Does anyone know?

Thanks!

. . . . . Pete
 
Keith, thanks...just what I thought!

So any advertisements/promotions claiming the wine is 1er Cru would be unacceptable!?!

. . . . Pete
 
originally posted by Peter Creasey:

This begs the question (hopefully the correct usage of this phrase!), what percentage of a wine must be from 1er Cru climat so that it can be advertised as 1er Cru?

I've done a good bit of googling and am unable to find any discussion on this.

Does anyone know?

Thanks!

. . . . . Pete
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Sorry, not the correct usage. Begs the question does not mean raises the question or demands that it be asked. It means that you have asserted something that assumes the answer to a question that you are supposedly arguing. It means the same thing as making a vicious argument.

But, I have to say, with sadness, that this seems to be a losing battle. Far more people think it means what you think it means than those who think it means what I think it means. Thus a nice image will become a meaningless idiom. Next in line is "it's a doggy-dog world."
 
originally posted by Peter Creasey:

Keith, thanks...just what I thought!

So any advertisements/promotions claiming the wine is 1er Cru would be unacceptable!?!

. . . . Pete
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Not necessarily! If all of the vines are in the 1er Cru sections, then the resulting wine is indeed 1er Cru. In the bad old days (pre-1973), growers who had grapes in both sections would sometimes blend them together in barrel or in bottle and sell the resulting wine as 1er Cru anyway. And I fondly recall some odd-ball Burgundy brought in by Pacific Wine Company that came from the non-1er Cru section of a vineyard. (Names redacted to protect the disorderly) Delicious, but not for the faint of heart.
 
originally posted by Andrew Zachary:
If all of the vines are in the 1er Cru sections, then the resulting wine is indeed 1er Cru.
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Andrew, I guess I don't understand as I don't think that is what we're talking about here.

If part of the fruit from a particular vineyard is from lieu-dit land and, say, 50 - 75% of the fruit is from the 1er Cru land, then it would not be right to claim the bottling is 1er Cru...is this not correct? This seems to be borne out by the producer not indicating 1er Cru on his bottle labeling.

In this case, the claims of 1er Cru designation by purveyors would seem to be in error.

. . . . . Pete
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originally posted by Peter Creasey:

originally posted by Andrew Zachary:
If all of the vines are in the 1er Cru sections, then the resulting wine is indeed 1er Cru.
Click to expand...

Andrew, I guess I don't understand as I don't think that is what we're talking about here.

If part of the fruit from a particular vineyard is from lieu-dit land and, say, 50 - 75% of the fruit is from the 1er Cru land, then it would not be right to claim the bottling is 1er Cru...is this not correct? This seems to be borne out by the producer not indicating 1er Cru on his bottle labeling.

In this case, the claims of 1er Cru designation by purveyors would seem to be in error.

. . . . . Pete
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You are right. If the producer hasn't marked the wine 1er Cru, the purveyors are wrong to sell it as 1er Cru.

Would be nice to know the producer and the vineyard. Is there some particular reason you're being so careful with that information?
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originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
But, I have to say, with sadness, that this seems to be a losing battle.
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When the most common usage for the usage for what you think it means is in the context of telling people what they think it means rather than what you think it means it's not a losing battle, it's lost. Varietal is the same way.
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It's kind of pleasantly Borgesian to have a phrase that is only used correctly by people expressing how unhappy they are that it is used incorrectly.
 
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