Bottling

K

Ken Schramm

Ken Schramm
I am curious as to what the assembled have to say about the various manufacturers of bottling equipment? We are about the venture into the fray. I am eager to hear opinions on GAI, FiMer and Krones, if anyone is willing to offer their thoughts.

Thanks. KDS
 
The two times I worked with GAI I found them hard to sanitize and yielding a greater than acceptable level of variability in product. Neither time was in a winery I ran, so improper maintenance could have been the cause of the variability.

Bertalasso uniblocks have served me well.
 
Thanks, Bruce. We're in the 10,000-50,000 case/yr segment of the market. I don't know if we can afford a Bertolaso yet. Maybe I have missed something, but I haven't seen anything from them in the 8-14 fill head scale. I should contact Collopack. Bertolaso does make some impressive machines. I have been admiring them for a while.

Curious to know what kind of product variability you had with the GAI?
 
originally posted by Levi Dalton:
Bartolo Mascarello, Giuseppe Rinaldi, and Giacomo Conterno all use GAI for their bottling.
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Those are serious endorsements. Thanks, Levi. GAI seems to make a lot of machines, and to be a company we can grow with.

Hell of an interesting adventure, this. The toys just keep getting bigger, more fascinating, and really expensive. I love being the child of a music teacher and the department head of a college nursing program, but it didn't quite do as much as it could have to prepare me for this. I am grateful for all your help, and I am envious of the third and fifth and tenth generation winemaking families out there.

And why does the spell check function think winemaking is not a word? Politburo?
 
Ken:

Both times the DO pick-up varied pretty widely. And for one of the machines, corking--both insertion depth and amount of cork dust--was inconsistent.
In that second one the corker jaws were noticeably worn and in need of replacement.

Regards,

PS: The Bertolasso I currently (kinda) work with is a 14-spout filler so they do make them.
 
Thanks to everyone for the input. We ended up with a GAI 1301, and so far we have been happy with it. Our biggest problem has been that the hose that came with our steam generator is still putting out steam with a horrendous smell, that has to be rinsed out with multiple water and acid rinses. We have soaked the hose in caustic and acid baths, and it still stinks to high heaven when there is steam run through it at pressure.

If anyone has a recommendation for A) a treatment that will neutralize this hose, or B) a hose that will do the job without smelling like a tire factory, I will gladly send mead your way. We are frustrated.

Thanks,
Ken
 
originally posted by Ken Schramm:
Steam Hose?Thanks to everyone for the input. We ended up with a GAI 1301, and so far we have been happy with it. Our biggest problem has been that the hose that came with our steam generator is still putting out steam with a horrendous smell, that has to be rinsed out with multiple water and acid rinses. We have soaked the hose in caustic and acid baths, and it still stinks to high heaven when there is steam run through it at pressure.

If anyone has a recommendation for A) a treatment that will neutralize this hose, or B) a hose that will do the job without smelling like a tire factory, I will gladly send mead your way. We are frustrated.

Thanks,
Ken
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So if there is mold in the hose, quaternary ammonium or bleach is not sporicidal, however iodophors and hydrogen peroxide are. Perhaps coil up the hose after filling it with the disinfectant and fill a tub up with the solution and let soak overnight. Really depends on the culprit for the bad odor . . .

Using citric acid probably won't do the job.

Perhaps Mike Dashe has a better suggestion for hoses.
 
If the steam smells like a tire factory, the problem may be that the steam is extracting a plasticizer from the hose material itself. That would be problematic from two angles: a steady supply of plasticizer odor and growing brittleness of the hose itself. Is the hose temperature rated for steam, Ken?

Mark Lipton
 
originally posted by mark e:
So if there is mold in the hose, quaternary ammonium or bleach is not sporicidal, however iodophors and hydrogen peroxide are. Perhaps coil up the hose after filling it with the disinfectant and fill a tub up with the solution and let soak overnight. Really depends on the culprit for the bad odor . . .

Using citric acid probably won't do the job.

Perhaps Mike Dashe has a better suggestion for hoses.
Click to expand...

The hose smelled terrible brand new, right out of the gate. We did not suspect mold, but you are right, we should not rule anything out. We did an overnight soak in NaOH, and two subsequent shorter soaks with Five Star SaniClean Acid sanitizer, and it did not alleviate the problem. The SaniClean did get the hose to emit a sulfurous scent during its soak, and we will try one more overnight pass at that.

originally posted by MLipton:
If the steam smells like a tire factory, the problem may be that the steam is extracting a plasticizer from the hose material itself. That would be problematic from two angles: a steady supply of plasticizer odor and growing brittleness of the hose itself. Is the hose temperature rated for steam, Ken?

Mark Lipton
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I agree with your assessment on the plasticizer. It smells like hot rubber. We checked the steam from the connection before the hose, and no problem coming right out of the generator. It is the steam-rated hose spec'ed by (and purchased from) the manufacturer's rep from their accessories list. Kind of at a loss. If another overnight acid soak does not eliminate the smell, we may just buy a new section of NovaFlex food grade steam hose and rebuild it.

Yes, count me in as very grateful for the expertise and generosity of the members here, as well. Sincere thank you very much.
 
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