TN: Duck! It's the Liquidator (Nov. 23, 2021)

Jeff Grossman

Jeff Grossman
attendees: Brad, Jay, Jayson, Jeff, Manuel + Julian, Marty, Victor

Manuel is in the States for his regular medical pilgrimmage to Philadelphia, but he is in NYC for glitz, glamor, shows, art... and little ol' us.

2021-11-23-group.jpg
We meet at Peking Duck House in midtown, a venue of good duck and a hit-or-miss menu otherwise. But they have big tables, nice service, they know us, it's convenient, and so we do.

Manuel is attended by his son, Julian, last seen about waist high but he has become a teenager with a personality all his own and front-row seats to see why his old man is the way he is.

Marty, another name out of our storied past, is here, too. We play that old favorite game, "What did you do during the pandemic?", and then conversation follows the course you might expect from a bunch of guys who drink fancy wine... what is this? where did you get it? how many have we had? what did it cost back then? is that a Gabriel Glas? Dressner would be proud of us. Give it a little time.

It's a Tuesday so we don't go too much beyond a dozen wines. In the order I tasted them, which may not have been optimal (but such is Life):

Roses de Jeanne (Bouchard) 2019 Cote de Val Vilaine - disg. 2021(!), 12.5%, fresh and lively, fine tension and texture, perhaps there is a peach in the next room, excellent

Extradimensional Wine Co. Yeah! 2019 Old Vine Orange Wine Yeah! - 13%, making me write "Yeah!" multiple times does not engender the kind of sentiment that perhaps the winemaker intends; the label says this is muscat, paolomino, chasselas, and others as yet unidentified - seems to me that "white field blend" covers it; 60(!) days on the skins, the nose is amazing: potently fruity, sage and cranberry twisted up with vivid yellow fruit; the palate, however, does not even come close: flat, limp, maybe even a little tinny; maybe I'm glad this isn't on my nickel

Josef Walter 2015 Spatburgunder "J" Hundsruck - trocken, 1076-001-18, 13.5%, pure pinot fruit with noseal threads of toasted barley, tea, and potting soil (I'm not doing it justice), so lightweight on the palate, an OMG finish of black earth, totally wow wine

Drouhin 1986 Chassagne-Montrachet 1er "Marquis de Laguiche" - technically Morgeot?; DOA

Pinon 2009 Vouvray "Silex Noir" - delicate, a mingle of green grapes and nectarines, a little sweet but maybe rather more unhappy to be opened

Clos de la Roilette (Coudert) 2019 Fleurie "Griffe du Marquis" - another wine unhappy to see the light of a Chinese restaurant: kinda gritty/earthy, something like madiran, interesting but really unforthcoming now

Clos Roche Blanche 2009 Touraine "Cuvee Gamay" - a fabulous bottle: potent, fragrant, blue-fruited, others taste more geranium than I do, just-so tannins, and a dancing texture, wow

Drouhin 1988 Musigny GC - someone says "the nose is intoxicating", which it is, but it does not follow-up in the mouth, yet another un-generous wine

Drouhin 2001 Chambolle-Musigny 1er "Baudes" - this one is happy to join us at the table: tangy and very red-fruited, recognizably Chambolle from a warm but not too-hot year, yum

Dublere 2015 Morey-Saint-Denis 1er "Les Blanchards" - first scent is coffee... but it's not over-toasted barrels just the roasty grapes from the hot year, a complicated palate but not especially enjoyable; Day 3: the palate has settled down a bit, all black cherries and all a little too sweet

Prager 2016 Ried Klaus Smaragd (R) - marca registrada?, this was stunning: bright and dry and fruity, pale earth tones in the finish, an amazing bottle!

Ch. Belair 1983 St.-Emilion, 1er Grand Cru Classe - magnum; suave and stylish on top yet still quite sturdy below, acidity is a bit tame but this really deserves to have more time spent on it

Bod. Riojanas 1970 Rioja Gran Reserva "Monte Real" - very pretty wine, very Rioja wine (sandalwood and dry cherries), interesting and makes me salivate

Weegmuller 2002 Haardter Mandelring Scheurebe Auslese - 5 174 103 020 03, 9%, HGS assisted here... how do we know? "It smells like grapefruit, Jay is here, and it's from a half-bottle" -Marty, indeed it is very grapefruity and sweet, it's maybe lost a bit of its cut and acquired a whiff of maple, but it's still pretty amazing

2021-11-23-bottles1.jpg

2021-11-23-bottles2.jpg


Credit for all pictures to Brad Kane.
 
Nice work. Always good to see a CRB outshining a Musigny.

How did Manuel's son enjoy dinner with the Wine Adults. I suppose he's had some practice at that by now.

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Josef Walter 2015 Spatburgunder "J" Hundsruck...an OMG finish of black earth, totally wow wine

I hadn't heard of this, but it seems that Lyle imports it to the US. Prices in Germany are fair - 30-35euros - which is pretty good for a 'totally wow wine'!
 
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:

Extradimensional Wine Co. Yeah! 2019 Old Vine Orange Wine Yeah! ... the palate, however, does not even come close: flat, limp, maybe even a little tinny; maybe I'm glad this isn't on my nickel

The problem with a lot of orange wines: overpromise and underdeliver.

Bod. Riojanas 1970 Rioja Gran Reserva "Monte Real" - very pretty wine, very Rioja wine (sandalwood and dry cherries), interesting and makes me salivate

These old Riojanas(es?) deliver an interesting experience of being washed by an old library while wearing your most comfy slippers.
 
I've sat and read in old libraries and I frequently read in my slippers, but I've never been washed in a library and I usually take my slippers off before washing. What is being washed in an old library like?
 
Marty - if you're reading this did you decant the Musigny beforehand?

I thought even the Baudes was still a bit closed.

I kept hoping the 86 Drouhin would improve with air but while it got better it never became something worth drinking without a lot of wishful thinking.

The Prager was stunning. The Spatburgunder was surprisingly lovely.

The Belair was a beautifully mature Bordeaux.

Weegmuller was from a recent large auction lot so I was both pleased and relieved that it showed so well.

As a confirmed orange wine fan all I can say is ... I agree entirely with Jeff. Missed the mark for me.
 
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
What is being washed in an old library like?

Same as 森林浴, but in a library, not a forest.

Having googled this and gotten an explanation, I remain unpersuaded by the analogy. I guess I do immerse myself in books. But they don't, nevertheless, wash over me.
 
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
What is being washed in an old library like?

Same as 森林浴, but in a library, not a forest.

Having googled this and gotten an explanation, I remain unpersuaded by the analogy. I guess I do immerse myself in books. But they don't, nevertheless, wash over me.

Ah, the unwashed masses...how sad.
 
originally posted by Rahsaan:
Nice work. Always good to see a CRB outshining a Musigny.

How did Manuel's son enjoy dinner with the Wine Adults. I suppose he's had some practice at that by now.

He loved when we made jokes at Manuel's expense.
 
originally posted by Rahsaan:
Nice work. Always good to see a CRB outshining a Musigny.

How did Manuel's son enjoy dinner with the Wine Adults. I suppose he's had some practice at that by now.
Yes, I think he's seen pop's antics before.

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Josef Walter 2015 Spatburgunder "J" Hundsruck...an OMG finish of black earth, totally wow wine
I hadn't heard of this, but it seems that Lyle imports it to the US. Prices in Germany are fair - 30-35euros - which is pretty good for a 'totally wow wine'!
And unobtainable, as far as I can see. Marty did say he buys them instantly upon offer.
 
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
What is being washed in an old library like?

Same as 森林浴, but in a library, not a forest.

Having googled this and gotten an explanation, I remain unpersuaded by the analogy. I guess I do immerse myself in books. But they don't, nevertheless, wash over me.

Ah, the unwashed masses...how sad.

Oh, dear, if you allow books to wash over you, I fear you may not be reading them with the attention they deserve, unless, of course, they are beach reading, in which case, what are you doing in an old library?
 
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
What is being washed in an old library like?

Same as 森林浴, but in a library, not a forest.

Having googled this and gotten an explanation, I remain unpersuaded by the analogy. I guess I do immerse myself in books. But they don't, nevertheless, wash over me.

Ah, the unwashed masses...how sad.

Oh, dear, if you allow books to wash over you, I fear you may not be reading them with the attention they deserve, unless, of course, they are beach reading, in which case, what are you doing in an old library?

Allow me to introduce you to a concept that you have understandably not encountered previously in your profession. The metaphor. You can google it.
 
It was so great to see so many old friends again. Has been way too long.

I didn't decant the Musigny, which maybe was a mistake. I found it to be quite closed aromatically at first, then later on it opened up a lot, and then it closed down again, all in the space of a few hours. As Jeff said, it didn't give much on the palate at any point.

There were some really nice bottles on the table. I particularly loved the CRB (duh), the Prager, the Belair, and the Monte Real. The Bouchard was pretty delicious too.

I do indeed buy my Walter Spatburgunders from Lyle. To me they are kind of irresistible bargains relative to the quality. The Hundsruck is I think the priciest of them, at around $60 per bottle. When they're on, they're really really good, and even when they're young they show characteristics one finds more often in really good bottles of aged Burgundy (see Jeff's note). Weirdly they are all bottled under screwcap.

I'm a little sad nobody liked the Orange wine, but it's true the nose was way better than the palate. FWIW the palate does put on a little more weight and integrates better with the aromatics after a couple of days of air.
 
originally posted by Marty L.:


I'm a little sad nobody liked the Orange wine, but it's true the nose was way better than the palate. FWIW the palate does put on a little more weight and integrates better with the aromatics after a couple of days of air.

Hi Marty, I’m Jim. I don’t believe we’ve met (unless my memory fails).

I zeroed in on this comment because I have tried a lot of orange wine and even made several vintages of it and have always found that they take awhile to show well. I do believe one can wait too long (depending on producer and cepage) but many I’ve had (even the domestic ones) almost require 8-10 years to be ready.
The 2011 skin-fermented Sauvignon Blanc I made is just getting there now after a decade of not being at all friendly and many of the Gravner orange wines I’ve tasted needed a decade or more.
Interesting wines but more like reds than whites for aging, IMO.
Best, Jim
 
originally posted by Jay Miller:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
What is being washed in an old library like?

Same as 森林浴, but in a library, not a forest.

Having googled this and gotten an explanation, I remain unpersuaded by the analogy. I guess I do immerse myself in books. But they don't, nevertheless, wash over me.

Ah, the unwashed masses...how sad.

Oh, dear, if you allow books to wash over you, I fear you may not be reading them with the attention they deserve, unless, of course, they are beach reading, in which case, what are you doing in an old library?

Allow me to introduce you to a concept that you have understandably not encountered previously in your profession. The metaphor. You can google it.

Allow me to introduce you to metaphysical wit. If you took more than introductory English as an undergraduate, you may have encountered it.

And, to return to my real point, what experience of reading books in a library is aptly figured as having the library wash over you? I suppose if you just sit there and meditate upon being surrounded by old books, that would be apt. It's also not a very good way to experience a library, unless you like the smell of paper and cardboard.
 
originally posted by Florida Jim:
originally posted by Marty L.:


I'm a little sad nobody liked the Orange wine, but it's true the nose was way better than the palate. FWIW the palate does put on a little more weight and integrates better with the aromatics after a couple of days of air.

Hi Marty, I’m Jim. I don’t believe we’ve met (unless my memory fails).

I think you're right we've never met in person, Jim, but I've so enjoyed your writing over both here and on Therapy for many years, and your personality comes through so vividly in your writing that I feel like I know you---anyway, thank you for that gift. If you ever make it up to the Big Apple for a visit, I'd be delighted to open some bottles for you.

I zeroed in on this comment because I have tried a lot of orange wine and even made several vintages of it and have always found that they take awhile to show well. I do believe one can wait too long (depending on producer and cepage) but many I’ve had (even the domestic ones) almost require 8-10 years to be ready.
The 2011 skin-fermented Sauvignon Blanc I made is just getting there now after a decade of not being at all friendly and many of the Gravner orange wines I’ve tasted needed a decade or more.
Interesting wines but more like reds than whites for aging, IMO.
Best, Jim

Thanks for that perspective. The aromas alone on this particular bottling are so spectacular it's almost a shame not to open it now, but I will tuck another bottle away for a few years and see what happens.

My own experience with Orange wines has been mixed, with some real highs (usually involving exotic tropical aromas like this bottle offered) and also some put-aside-for-cooking bottles that smelled and tasted mostly like ciders or IPAs. I find with Hardy's bottles and Enderle & Moll the hit rate is pretty good, and when the wines are on, they offer something unusual and compelling enough that it's worth taking a bit of a gamble on them.
 
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:

And, to return to my real point, what experience of reading books in a library is aptly figured as having the library wash over you? I suppose if you just sit there and meditate upon being surrounded by old books, that would be apt. It's also not a very good way to experience a library, unless you like the smell of paper and cardboard.

Which reminds us that casual jesting with Jonathan is no joke.
 
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