originally posted by Bill Lundstrom:
originally posted by georg lauer:
originally posted by Peter Creasey:
Bill, I wrote that very quickly without thinking and probably should not have done so. That approach can be risky.
I have deleted that posting.
. . . . . . Pete
what exactly was the problem? it works unless you forget the bottle.
30 minutes in my freezer (unless refrigerator was meant) and the wine is a couple degrees above freezing. the wine in the neck where there's less volume is going to be frozen. Even if your freezer won't freeze wine after 30 minutes it's way too cold to appreciate.
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Stores near me keep a cold slush bath ready in case you buy a room-temperature bottle and want it chilled. The bath takes 5-10 minutes to get a reasonable chill.
I occasionally put drinks in the freezer, if I want that extra thrill from the cold but, anyway, a wine with lots of dissolved CO2 may not behave like a more liquidy liquid. I'd need a physicist to back me up, but I think, as the liquid component chills, it becomes less able to hold the gas. That means more pressure on the seal and, eventually, wine-ice that will be flat when it melts.
originally posted by georg lauer:
which is why we usually have a few bottles in the fridge) but beats drinking no champagne or a bottle that is too warm.
originally posted by MLipton:
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Stores near me keep a cold slush bath ready in case you buy a room-temperature bottle and want it chilled. The bath takes 5-10 minutes to get a reasonable chill.
I occasionally put drinks in the freezer, if I want that extra thrill from the cold but, anyway, a wine with lots of dissolved CO2 may not behave like a more liquidy liquid. I'd need a physicist to back me up, but I think, as the liquid component chills, it becomes less able to hold the gas. That means more pressure on the seal and, eventually, wine-ice that will be flat when it melts.
Yes, when the solution hits a critical point, in this case the freezing point, any solutes including carbon dioxide are left behind. This is why the Arctic Ocean is more saline: some of the water has been removed from the seawater as ice.
Mark Lipton
You and I are saying basically the same thing, Jayson. You don’t want to freeze the wine as you would lose the bubbles upon opening (we do a freeze-pump-thaw cycle to degas solvents). The situation as you cool the solution is complicated: the solubility of co2 in water increases with decreasing temperature, but the shrinking of the gases in the headspace shifts the equilibrium in the opposite direction. Clear as mud, right?originally posted by Jayson Cohen:
originally posted by MLipton:
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Stores near me keep a cold slush bath ready in case you buy a room-temperature bottle and want it chilled. The bath takes 5-10 minutes to get a reasonable chill.
I occasionally put drinks in the freezer, if I want that extra thrill from the cold but, anyway, a wine with lots of dissolved CO2 may not behave like a more liquidy liquid. I'd need a physicist to back me up, but I think, as the liquid component chills, it becomes less able to hold the gas. That means more pressure on the seal and, eventually, wine-ice that will be flat when it melts.
Yes, when the solution hits a critical point, in this case the freezing point, any solutes including carbon dioxide are left behind. This is why the Arctic Ocean is more saline: some of the water has been removed from the seawater as ice.
Mark Lipton
Not sure exactly what you and Jeff are saying here because you don’t want to actually freeze the wine or cause a bulk phase transition. If you stay above freezing, the dissolved CO2 in the liquid bulk is more stable as T decreases and the gaseous head space cools too, lowering collision rate and pressure there. When the layer in the neck gets toward freezing/slushy or freezes, like between 0 and 4C, because it’s a closed system, seems to me CO2 in the remaining bulk liquid will be trapped although the CO2 in the headspace could increase as CO2 is expelled from the slushy/freezing neck region, but enough to increase pressure on the cork above where it was at cellar or fridge or room temp? Not sure about that. Do I have this wrong?