CWD: What did you drink last night (or whenever)?

[Jeff Grossman]

LDM sez:
"The estate rents vines in the Gorges cru that used to belong to regarded grower Michel Brégeon. The plot is 1.67 hectares and was planted in the late 1960/early 1970's. Because it is so far from the estate, their colleague Fred Laillé works the vines organically, Pépière works his Clisson vines and they exchange hand-harvested fruit. Gorges is the only area in the Muscadet featuring basalt soils. The wines have a unique structure compared to the others of the region."

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
LDM sez:
"The estate rents vines in the Gorges cru that used to belong to regarded grower Michel Brégeon. The plot is 1.67 hectares and was planted in the late 1960/early 1970's. Because it is so far from the estate, their colleague Fred Laillé works the vines organically, Pépière works his Clisson vines and they exchange hand-harvested fruit. Gorges is the only area in the Muscadet featuring basalt soils. The wines have a unique structure compared to the others of the region."

Thanks for that. Basalt, waddya know. Didn't detect any volcanic signature, to the limited extent that I might claim to have a handle on that supposed characteristic (a certain kinda smokiness?).

 

[Ian Fitzsimmons]

Thanks for looking it up, Jeff, I didn't realize this was an ongoing arrangement.

Basalt is relatively rich in iron and magnesium, as opposed to, say, Kimmeridgian soil, which should be rich in calcium carbonate. I read a plausible explanation many years ago of why vine uptake of calcium might bear on the texture of the wines grown in Kimmeridgian clay and marl but haven't seen anything analogous with respect to iron and magnesium (which you read about more often in connection with red wines, anyway).

My recollection of the Bregeon Gorges was of a supremely glassy, placid texture, which somewhat masked the flavors of a wine that never quite seemed to reach full maturity. This would have been the 2004, which I tasted several times over about a decade.

 

[Jeff Grossman]

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
LDM sez:
"The estate rents vines in the Gorges cru that used to belong to regarded grower Michel Brégeon. The plot is 1.67 hectares and was planted in the late 1960/early 1970's. Because it is so far from the estate, their colleague Fred Laillé works the vines organically, Pépière works his Clisson vines and they exchange hand-harvested fruit. Gorges is the only area in the Muscadet featuring basalt soils. The wines have a unique structure compared to the others of the region."

Thanks for that. Basalt, waddya know. Didn't detect any volcanic signature, to the limited extent that I might claim to have a handle on that supposed characteristic (a certain kinda smokiness?).

I think that's right. Not perfumey but minerally/smoky.

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
LDM sez:
"The estate rents vines in the Gorges cru that used to belong to regarded grower Michel Brégeon. The plot is 1.67 hectares and was planted in the late 1960/early 1970's. Because it is so far from the estate, their colleague Fred Laillé works the vines organically, Pépière works his Clisson vines and they exchange hand-harvested fruit. Gorges is the only area in the Muscadet featuring basalt soils. The wines have a unique structure compared to the others of the region."

Thanks for that. Basalt, waddya know. Didn't detect any volcanic signature, to the limited extent that I might claim to have a handle on that supposed characteristic (a certain kinda smokiness?).

I think that's right. Not perfumey but minerally/smoky.

Buoyed by the positive experience with the 2014 Pepière Gorges, we had a go at the 2015 version, also 12%. As susceptible to suggestion as the next guy, this time I detected some smokiness, presumably from the gabbro. Unlike the 14, the 15 was a bit closed, much like the 14 was three years ago. But then 15 was a hard vintage, as vee all know. Even for a Muscadet. But the mouth was just as attractive: minerally, salty, zippy, larry, and curly.

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

2018 Gilles Berlioz Chignin-Bergeron Les Christine 13.5%
100% Roussanne. Not my favorite grape for acidity deficiency reasons, but I was hoping a more northerly/cooler specimen might do the trick. This is Berlioz's top of the pops white, from a very select parcel, named after the missus, and on the expensive side. Expressive nose, a cross between pineapples and peaches, trying its incongruous best to place Savoy somewhere in the tropics. Also, and most surprisingly, enough cat pee to make a savvy gnome blanch. Attractive density and concentration, showing some attractive spice hints, but, alas, still deficient in the acidity department, despite a game effort by the bitterness department to step into the breach. Interesting, but not my cuppa. Glad I only bought one.

 

[Claude Kolm]

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
2018 Gilles Berlioz Chignin-Bergeron Les Christine 13.5%
100% Roussanne. Not my favorite grape for acidity deficiency reasons, but I was hoping a more northerly/cooler specimen might do the trick. This is Berlioz's top of the pops white, from a very select parcel, named after the missus, and on the expensive side. Expressive nose, a cross between pineapples and peaches, trying its incongruous best to place Savoy somewhere in the tropics. Also, and most surprisingly, enough cat pee to make a savvy gnome blanch. Attractive density and concentration, showing some attractive spice hints, but, alas, still deficient in the acidity department, despite a game effort by the bitterness department to step into the breach. Interesting, but not my cuppa. Glad I only bought one.

Try the cousin, Adrien Berlioz. Much, much, much better wines.

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

originally posted by Claude Kolm:

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
2018 Gilles Berlioz Chignin-Bergeron Les Christine 13.5%
100% Roussanne. Not my favorite grape for acidity deficiency reasons, but I was hoping a more northerly/cooler specimen might do the trick. This is Berlioz's top of the pops white, from a very select parcel, named after the missus, and on the expensive side. Expressive nose, a cross between pineapples and peaches, trying its incongruous best to place Savoy somewhere in the tropics. Also, and most surprisingly, enough cat pee to make a savvy gnome blanch. Attractive density and concentration, showing some attractive spice hints, but, alas, still deficient in the acidity department, despite a game effort by the bitterness department to step into the breach. Interesting, but not my cuppa. Glad I only bought one.

Try the cousin, Adrien Berlioz. Much, much, much better wines.

Your advice is my command. Both colors?

 

[Claude Kolm]

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:

originally posted by Claude Kolm:

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
2018 Gilles Berlioz Chignin-Bergeron Les Christine 13.5%
100% Roussanne. Not my favorite grape for acidity deficiency reasons, but I was hoping a more northerly/cooler specimen might do the trick. This is Berlioz's top of the pops white, from a very select parcel, named after the missus, and on the expensive side. Expressive nose, a cross between pineapples and peaches, trying its incongruous best to place Savoy somewhere in the tropics. Also, and most surprisingly, enough cat pee to make a savvy gnome blanch. Attractive density and concentration, showing some attractive spice hints, but, alas, still deficient in the acidity department, despite a game effort by the bitterness department to step into the breach. Interesting, but not my cuppa. Glad I only bought one.

Try the cousin, Adrien Berlioz. Much, much, much better wines.

Your advice is my command. Both colors?

Start with the whites. The reds (at least some) are coming in at 10% alcohol, if you can believe it.

 

[Jeff Grossman]

Thanks to you both, Oswaldo and Claude. I am planning a trip to the Savoie in January so am starting to buy/taste bottles from the region.

 

[Mark Anisman]

we had a delightful visit to Domaine Jean Masson & Fils ~ 15 years ago. visit capped off with a visit by the Grenoble mayor, who came by for his annual fix. Mssr. Masson celebrated with opening a 1982 magnum of his wine!

 

[Jeff Grossman]

Outstanding.

 

[Zachary Ross]

originally posted by Brézème:
Based in which village?
There is no Moulin à vent village. The cru is shared by Romanèches Thorin and Chénas.
Thillardon or Rottiers might be what you are looking for.
I think the wines are true to their terroir, without the sophistication of some of the best wines made by some Macon or Fleurie vignerons (a sign of transparency in my mind).
Chateau des Jacques is one of the most unbojo beaujolais that I have tried. Like most of the beaujolais wines made by Bourguignons driving down.

I finally got around to trying Rottiers last night - the 2020 Richard Rottiers Moulin-à-Vent Dernier Souffle. Hoo-boy was this delicious. From a vineyard planted in granite rocks near a cemetery, hence the ghostly name; 60-year-old vines, partial carbonic, six months elevage in used oak. Purple, violets, rich and sweet red fruit with lovely balance and tension. Drained quickly - good thing I bought a case! (cheap at about $20)

Thank you comrade Brézème for the recommendation.

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

2013 Laurent Tribut 1er Cru Beauroy 13.0%
A smidgen of minerality, a hint of butteriness, a whiff of oxidativeness, and gobs of fennel. Only the butteriness (from variety, not barrel) was unwelcome, partly because I expected a Tribut to be more Shaker-Quaker, or at least generic Protestant. Maybe Chablis and me, or even Burgundian Chardonnay as a category, we've lost that loving feeling. But Jura still often pleases, so...

2013 Vincent Dauvissat Irancy 13.0%
Now this was something else. While not mistakable for a PN that smells or tastes like it's from the coat door, it had reams of complexity in a package bordering on the ethereal empyrean. Truly satisfying, and in a non-predictable way. On day two it showed more herbaceous, as if weeds had started to sprout overnight, as is their way.

 

[Jonathan Loesberg]

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Not too shabby Chablis2013 Laurent Tribut 1er Cru Beauroy 13.0%
A smidgen of minerality, a hint of butteriness, a whiff of oxidativeness, and gobs of fennel. Only the butteriness (from variety, not barrel) was unwelcome, partly because I expected a Tribut to be more Shaker-Quaker, or at least generic Protestant. Maybe Chablis and me, or even Burgundian Chardonnay as a category, we've lost that loving feeling. But Jura still often pleases, so...

How can you tell where the butter comes from? With Chardonnay, I would guess malolactic, but it would be easy to prove me wrong or right if the domaine had a web page that described vinification.

 

[Peter Creasey]

originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg: How can you tell where the butter comes from? With Chardonnay, I would guess malolactic, but it would be easy to prove me wrong or right if the domaine had a web page that described vinification.

I'm stumped as I try to think of another answer to "where the butter comes from" other than malolactic.

. . . . . . Pete

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Not too shabby Chablis2013 Laurent Tribut 1er Cru Beauroy 13.0%
A smidgen of minerality, a hint of butteriness, a whiff of oxidativeness, and gobs of fennel. Only the butteriness (from variety, not barrel) was unwelcome, partly because I expected a Tribut to be more Shaker-Quaker, or at least generic Protestant. Maybe Chablis and me, or even Burgundian Chardonnay as a category, we've lost that loving feeling. But Jura still often pleases, so...

How can you tell where the butter comes from? With Chardonnay, I would guess malolactic, but it would be easy to prove me wrong or right if the domaine had a web page that described vinification.

I can't always be 100% sure, but I sense a significant difference between the aroma and/or flavor of new or newish oak, which can be found in any white made from any variety, and a different kind of villainous vanilla that I nearly always find in every Chardonnay that I taste, including unoaked or neutral-oaked ones from Louis Michel and Eric Texier, or even Ganevat. So, I guess I internalized these latter imprints. It's not just a pure taste sensation, there is a kind of viscosity attached.

I don't know if it results from malo. So many whites that undergo malo don't have it, but it could, of course, be the result of how it impacts this particular variety. Would be instructive if I could taste a barrel of unoaked Chardonnay that underwent malo next to one where the winemaker blocked it.

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

originally posted by Peter Creasey:

originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg: How can you tell where the butter comes from? With Chardonnay, I would guess malolactic, but it would be easy to prove me wrong or right if the domaine had a web page that described vinification.

I'm stumped as I try to think of another answer to "where the butter comes from" other than malolactic.

. . . . . . Pete

I suspect it's a primary fermentation characteristic of the variety itself, and not the result of malo. I think Eric has a point of view about this, would be great if he could chime in.

 

[Pavel Tchichikov]

within the realm of my favorite Chablis houses, Tribut is somewhat broad shouldered(*). I might even single out Beauroy as such, and blame site characteristics. Have yet to pick up anything buttery though, but perhaps it's time to revisit one.

there are Tribut connoisseurs lurking around this place, but their contributions continue to be limited by their struggling to fit into their clothes all day long.

as far as fulfilling my duties as the politburo-appointed premox watchdog for the current 5-year plan goes, i suppose there is a chance this bottle was 10% into its fall into nothingness which would still make it thoroughly enjoyable despite some weirdness. Anecdotally, the number of 1999s and 2000s that showed this way around 2007 was alarming, and by 2012 things had not progressed linearly.

(*) not sure I had ever exercised the patience to have one old enough to see if it converged to a place where the more racy-styled Chablis ends up as well.

 

[mark e]

originally posted by Pavel Tchichikov:


there are Tribut connoisseurs lurking around this place, but their contributions continue to be limited by their struggling to fit into their clothes all day long.

I think I may know one who may or may not have grown stout, but certainly drinks far too much Swabian wine.