CWD: what did you drink while traveling?
- Thread starter Pavel Tchichikov
- Start date
Karen Goetz
Karen Goetz
Gee, that's quite a jump. I didn't realize I had that much power! With respect, I am expressing my feelings about seeing "cunt" used by you on this wine forum. I am not telling anyone what to say. I'm sure we are all familiar with "casual' pejorative terms based on gender, race, religion, orientation. It's interesting what still seems acceptable. We are often inured to the use of epithets when we are not hurt by them. Personally, I hope the world continues to move away from this stuff.
Your edited version has made this discussion into an ugly attack.
robert ames
robert ames
in Ireland it is about as pejorative as "dork" or "dick". mind you I am not saying that those are "nice" words.
what about john lennon's "woman is the nigger of the world" or patti smith's "rock and roll nigger"? bestowing too much opporbrium to a word only empowers those that use it as hate speech that much more "naughtiness" because no one else will even mouth the word.
but no worries about all that, because it appears that we are set to be a nation of Moonies and Jonestown kool-aid drinkers.
what about john lennon's "woman is the nigger of the world" or patti smith's "rock and roll nigger"? bestowing too much opporbrium to a word only empowers those that use it as hate speech that much more "naughtiness" because no one else will even mouth the word.
but no worries about all that, because it appears that we are set to be a nation of Moonies and Jonestown kool-aid drinkers.
Jonathan Loesberg
Jonathan Loesberg
I don't believe that word, as used by either Lennon or Smith is remotely analagous. And I'm with Karen on the use of cunt. I know, in certain contexts, it is used neutrally. But mostly not.
I do, however, envy Fatboy's 76 Mont Redon, even if he variously misspells "the," for a reason that remains obscure to me.
Peter Creasey
Peter Creasey
Well said, Jonathan.
. . . . . Pete
. . . . . Pete
Jonathan Loesberg
Jonathan Loesberg
Well, since you invite me to, I'll ask the very best field informant I can find: you.
Why is it "teh...quirks," but "the fuck."
Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
my newspeak is a little rusty, but i believe they are different parts of speech
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
In other words, teh first is hoochspeak and the second is speechspeak.
Jonathan Loesberg
Jonathan Loesberg
Fuck is a very malleable word. It can be a noun, as in "I don't give a fuck." Indeed, really, any time a word takes an article, definitive or not, it is being used as a noun. If one said "when the green hits your eye like a big pizza pie, that's a love," green would be a noun. If you can noun an adjective, you can certainly noun a verb.
Ken Schramm
Ken Schramm
I took some bottles with me on my last out of town venture. I poured at the SugarBelt RVA Mead fest a few weeks ago. For those who are lovers of Lambics, Raf Souverens at Bokke creates some of the most complex and memorable bottles I have ever tasted. This one was exemplary.
The most creative and respected parts of the world of Lambic and sour beer have been beautifully documented in Bottle Conditioned - certainly worth the watch for those who want to consider themselves well informed about the world's great artisanal beverages.
The most creative and respected parts of the world of Lambic and sour beer have been beautifully documented in Bottle Conditioned - certainly worth the watch for those who want to consider themselves well informed about the world's great artisanal beverages.
Christian Miller (CMM)
Christian Miller
I actually can't remember the specific wine I'm going to talk about, but that's not the point. This was about a month ago, in Paris at Obonobo, the wine bar annex of the good value modern bistro Gare au Gorille.
I didn't recognize anything on the glass list. Knowing that it tilted strongly natural, I asked the bartender for a red or rosé recommendation to go with our little plates (which were very good), explaining that I liked all sorts of wine, but had a low tolerance for volatile acidity. He chose a wine - it was a VdF from somewhere south involving both Negrette and Syrah and one or two other grapes. He said it had the least VA of any reds on the list.
The wine had nice fruit and acid, a peppery hint in the nose but with Negrette showing the most on the palate. However, the VA was distinctly there, an unwelcome guest fortunately standing just outside the door. The wine was particularly good with salami, and in that the VA might even have enhanced it slightly. But it really was at my limit.
Now if that was the red with the least VA, I have to believe that it's pretty loud in the other reds. Which would surely turn off a significant minority, if not a majority of wine drinkers. Makes me wonder if customers at such places self-select for VA tolerance, or if they just put up with it because the food and ambience is good, or don't notice, or they quietly lose customers who don't like such wines but don't interact with the staff. Probably a combination of all of those.
That said, kudos to the bartender who was understanding, warned me upfront about the wines, and selected the one I'd most likely enjoy. Not at all the stereotypical didactic or ideological natural wine seller.
I didn't recognize anything on the glass list. Knowing that it tilted strongly natural, I asked the bartender for a red or rosé recommendation to go with our little plates (which were very good), explaining that I liked all sorts of wine, but had a low tolerance for volatile acidity. He chose a wine - it was a VdF from somewhere south involving both Negrette and Syrah and one or two other grapes. He said it had the least VA of any reds on the list.
The wine had nice fruit and acid, a peppery hint in the nose but with Negrette showing the most on the palate. However, the VA was distinctly there, an unwelcome guest fortunately standing just outside the door. The wine was particularly good with salami, and in that the VA might even have enhanced it slightly. But it really was at my limit.
Now if that was the red with the least VA, I have to believe that it's pretty loud in the other reds. Which would surely turn off a significant minority, if not a majority of wine drinkers. Makes me wonder if customers at such places self-select for VA tolerance, or if they just put up with it because the food and ambience is good, or don't notice, or they quietly lose customers who don't like such wines but don't interact with the staff. Probably a combination of all of those.
That said, kudos to the bartender who was understanding, warned me upfront about the wines, and selected the one I'd most likely enjoy. Not at all the stereotypical didactic or ideological natural wine seller.
Claude Kolm
Claude Kolm
I guess that's the reason why I haven't even thought of going to Gare au Gorille in years. Last night at Soces the wine list seems to be evolving in that direction, too, although I can still find something to drink.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
I suspect many natural wine newbies, at least those who can recognize VA, are disappointed if they don't find it, because that means that the wine is square, or conventional, or whatever.
given all the foregoing, and the fact that only jonathan would read it anyway, it seems to me that starting teh thread fatboy drinks old chateauneuf-du-pape would be somewhat narcissistic tbh. but, having travelled back to teh fatschloß yesterday, and being more than usually disposed to living for teh day at the moment (duh), tonight i decided to crack teh 1979 cuvée des sommeliers to accompany some slow roasted pork belly &c.
i am glad i did. for a 45 year old, this wine was quite shockingly youthful, being both vigorous in color, and well adorned with primary fruit flavors. yes, the wild charcuterie on the nose and that hint of orange that is an indicator of age in grenache (and that i personally love), was there, but really, had i not known, i'd have never believed it was anything like this old. except for teh other give away, i guess, which is that it was insanely digestible, subtly complex and it vanished all too quickly... and i really wished it was a magnum.
i love this vintage of chateauneuf, but even in that context, this was teh bees knees.
may we all do our best to live well in dark times.
fb.
i am glad i did. for a 45 year old, this wine was quite shockingly youthful, being both vigorous in color, and well adorned with primary fruit flavors. yes, the wild charcuterie on the nose and that hint of orange that is an indicator of age in grenache (and that i personally love), was there, but really, had i not known, i'd have never believed it was anything like this old. except for teh other give away, i guess, which is that it was insanely digestible, subtly complex and it vanished all too quickly... and i really wished it was a magnum.
i love this vintage of chateauneuf, but even in that context, this was teh bees knees.
may we all do our best to live well in dark times.
fb.
Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
the professor likes to surprise us with an occasional pop quiz, so while only jonathan may in fact be interested, many have to read
with that in mind, and in anticipation of next semester's syllabus, i was curious if you may have come across the much celebrated, by the wine media, jean trintignant from the late 70s?
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
Not to be confused with the much celebrated, by the film media, jean-louis trintignant, arguably from the late 70s, born in Vaucluse, where a much-sought-after CdP producer also makes a few bottles to console those who cannot afford the regular (a pop quiz which anyone worth their winesalt will know the answer to).
Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
typo fixed, thanks!