Springtime for Beaujolais
- Thread starter Rahsaan
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Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
is that what used to be Traditionnelle, or a different animal entirely?
if the former, unless i am confused beyond repair, there's a top layer of limestone mixture involved similar to brun's l'anciene
Claude Kolm
Claude Kolm
Wayne? Any gunpowder aromas?
robert ames
robert ames
vissoux orgine v.v. is a separate bottling. more $$ than the traditionelle, but less $$ than the cru bottlings.
I believe, but am not certain, that the traditionelle is no longer - split between the origine and coeur de vendanges. I wish they'd left it alone - back in the day, the trad was a major WD go to. But the origine is pretty close (the coeur, well, in certain vintages might be described as "foursquare". : )
2015 Georges Descombes Brouilly VV
This wine has always been overripe and difficult for my tastes, never providing much pleasure. Dark and roasted flavors, with a disjointed stewy palate that never evoked Descombes, Morgon, or even Beaujolais. And somehow, I ended up buying more of it than anything else!
Last night's bottle finally started to leave that phase, slowly approaching the airy silky elegance that I know and love in Descombes.
At the same time, flavors still very dark and roasted and I don't know how the balance between all these competing elements will evolve over time.
I am also unlikely to find out, as this was my last bottle!
(Also interesting that this dark roasted mess was 12.5% alcohol, whereas the recent hot vintages seem to be pushing higher)
This wine has always been overripe and difficult for my tastes, never providing much pleasure. Dark and roasted flavors, with a disjointed stewy palate that never evoked Descombes, Morgon, or even Beaujolais. And somehow, I ended up buying more of it than anything else!
Last night's bottle finally started to leave that phase, slowly approaching the airy silky elegance that I know and love in Descombes.
At the same time, flavors still very dark and roasted and I don't know how the balance between all these competing elements will evolve over time.
I am also unlikely to find out, as this was my last bottle!
(Also interesting that this dark roasted mess was 12.5% alcohol, whereas the recent hot vintages seem to be pushing higher)
At the risk of sounding inflammatory, I’ll mention that this was precisely the reason that I bypassed 2015 in my Beaujolais and Burgundy purchases. On release, they were highly structured but also highly extracted and I was concerned about whether they’d ever posses the delicacy and grace that I prize in those regions. More and more, I’m skipping years for those reasons (2018-2020, eg) which fortunately comports well with my desire to reduce my purchasing in light of my advancing years. By 2030, I expect that I’ll mostly be buying bubbly and vin de soif whites.
Mark Lipton
Mark Lipton
Yes, that is probably a safe decision rule. I've enjoyed more 2015 wines from Burgundy and Beaujolais than I have from 2018, which has been a tougher vintage in my experience. But something went really wrong with this cuvee in 15.
Either way, I don't taste comprehensively and neither vintage suits my platonic ideals for their regions.
Either way, I don't taste comprehensively and neither vintage suits my platonic ideals for their regions.
Pretty wild, exciting type of Beaujolais at opening, with brett/VA in the wings...which came on full steam with air. Just couldn't get past it...very sadly consistent with my recent experience with them...previously probably my favorite Beaujolais along w JPs (granted very different styles)...
Oh, that's too bad to hear. I admit I haven't kept up with a lot of recent vintages, but G Descombes has been among my favorite Beaujolais for a long time. You think there has been a substantial shift in the winemaking? I wouldn't have imagined that.
Also too bad to hear about Alex F. I had a few of the early vintages and liked them, although found them pricey.
Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
thoroughly delicious '22 burgaud corcelette
if i were VLM i'd recommend drinking it now
if i were VLM i'd recommend drinking it now
I don't think of brett or VA being necessarily associated with a change in winemaking (it can of course) but generally I think it just comes with unclean cellar practices. I have to believe climate change and heat is making brett much more difficult to deal with as well.
I think of a lot of "natural" winemakers simply taking a laissez faire attitude approach to winemaking - ie "let the wine make itself" thus connecting cellar practice much more to winemaking - if you want to call it that.
I think Georges is still making the wine there so I think it's just something going on in the cellar.
It also seems to me that when you have something bacterial going on you suddenly introduce a lot of variability based on exposure to temps in transit, etc. I am convinced those of us on the West Coast buying through local distributors run a higher risk of this type of thing with low sulfur wines with latent brett. All our wines go through the Panama Canal, which East Coast wines don't. I realize NYC is super hot in the summer, but transit overall is just way shorter and cold in the winter. I just don't always trust those reefers to be fully functional - easy for wines to get warm at some point.
I don't think this potential issue is limited to the US. We were in Paris about a decade ago and I bought a bunch of different Yvon Metras from Caves Auge - every single one seriously brettified to the point of going down the sink. I just think there too it got hot somewhere.
I think the winemakers don't always know what the degree that brett may be present - something that might be subliminal, or a small dose of brett at the domaine associated with "winemaking" style, can be much worse further down the way. I'm curious if all winemakers test for brett regularly or if they rely on taste. I also have to believe that for some winemakers, as they age, keeping the rigor of the early years can be tough. As someone rapidly approaching 60, I know the challenge of the rally...