Robert Dentice
Robert Dentice
Small amount of VA that gave the wine a little zip that I liked.
The Beaujolais TN thread
- Thread starter BJ
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Small amount of VA that gave the wine a little zip that I liked.
Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
day 2 of tackling a beaujolais nouveau, secretly referred to in alphabet city as 2017 christian ducroux prologue
every bottle of this opened in the past 2-3 years has had considerably more CO2 than the predecessors consumed shortly after the truck (not figurative) was backed up on chambers street
each glass, last night and tonight, required quadruple-decanting
that said, once its fizzy aspirations are subdued, the wine is excellent: trademark ducroux purity, small-berried precision, delightfully low octane level, hint of forestal dampness i get sometimes from crb gamay.
really nice proportion of secondary development vis-a-vis retention of fruit freshness
every bottle of this opened in the past 2-3 years has had considerably more CO2 than the predecessors consumed shortly after the truck (not figurative) was backed up on chambers street
each glass, last night and tonight, required quadruple-decanting
that said, once its fizzy aspirations are subdued, the wine is excellent: trademark ducroux purity, small-berried precision, delightfully low octane level, hint of forestal dampness i get sometimes from crb gamay.
really nice proportion of secondary development vis-a-vis retention of fruit freshness
Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
no, this is your stash, the request to cancel subscription keeps bouncing. they keep sending to me, it's the strangest thing
'20 Hoppenot Morgon Corcelette OK, on this, Eric is spot on. Sort of a junior '03. Blowzy, heavy, anise, mushy, undertow of greenness. I do think this could age into something, but I'm not interested in being there to find out what it is. Gotta figure out how to move this on, beyond just drinking it (considering the several cases of '20 cru cuvees of have of his, any ideas?).
Robert Dentice
Robert Dentice
I wonder if the ole Natural wine shake would help? Is that still a thing??
Jeff Grossman
Jeff Grossman
Yeah, I thought that was mostly to de-gas Australian spoof.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
Wouldn't work for VA zip (despite the word volatile), only for CO2 zip.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
2013 Thivin Zaccharie was stately last night. With a decade of bottle life, it seemed to have outgrown the carbonic elements and become more Burgundian, so that the deliciousness seemed more grounded, less desirous to fruity-please.
Tonight I opened 2021 G Descombes Morgon VV in my Manhattan apartment, which was the first wine Gigi opened for us at the domaine when we visited in July. Obviously the environment was different, and I wondered if it could recapture the magic.
It was delicious and I was happy. A perfect combination of the juicy berry crystal clear Descombes VV fruit, with the silky fresh texture of 2021. The type of wine I like to drink and I will be drinking more in the future.
Maybe it didn't quite have the extra % of depth and life that we tasted at the domaine. Is that me or is that the wine. Who knows. All part of the process. But when the wine is good, who cares...
It was delicious and I was happy. A perfect combination of the juicy berry crystal clear Descombes VV fruit, with the silky fresh texture of 2021. The type of wine I like to drink and I will be drinking more in the future.
Maybe it didn't quite have the extra % of depth and life that we tasted at the domaine. Is that me or is that the wine. Who knows. All part of the process. But when the wine is good, who cares...
robert ames
robert ames
so was it heading down that evolutionary slippery slope to the condition referred in beaujolais as "pinotase", where, with age, beaujolais takes on the flavours and complexities of {heaven forbid} of wines from the north, commanly known as burgundy?
robert ames
robert ames
Florida Jim
Florida Jim
No shame in it.
Jeff Grossman
Jeff Grossman
I think pinote takes more than a couple years to happen.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
That didn't occur to me while drinking it, but it could have. Your comment made me remember how, during my first wine-drinking decade, I considered Gamay the variety I could most easily identify blind. There was something so distinctive about it, more so than any other variety (except perhaps Gewürz). Back then, the natural wine movement was still hatching, so the only semi-carbonic wines around New York were Beaujolais. One day it finally dawned on me that I had been mistaken all along, that what I thought was so distinctive about Gamay was simply the aroma and flavor of semi-carbonic fermentation.
Here the camera cuts across to an almost 20-year-old scene of chatting with David Lillie in the first Chambers shop. He said he believed that the older a wine gets, the more reflective of origin it becomes, and the less reflective of how it was made. Drink for thought.
Putting the two together, with some licence: semi-carbonic wines do tend to taste less so with time, inviting the question, suggesting the question, eliciting the question: when people say that Gamay tends to pinoter, could they be mostly (and simply) referring to the eventual waning of the (rather obtrusive) semi-carbonic character? After all, Gamay and Pinot Noir are structurally similar, and may be organoleptically more similar than is generally supposed, since most people (who are not Brun fanatics) have less contact with non-carbonic Gamay. In other words, the same confusion I used to make, except in reverse.
Interesting idea. Although I thought people often cite the Jadot Beaujolais wines as prime candidates to pinote.
More broadly, I suppose one could think of it as a subset of the phenomenon of aged red wines tasting more and more similar as they go tertiary. Along that curve, grapes that are closer will converge first. And if the prestige were reversed, we might say the Burgundies gamayify/gamayer.