Newb-alert and a call to action in IL

I'm all for you being able to buy from any state you want to buy from. Furthermore, so should your 18-year-old child.

So, what's the big deal? Why don't you get involved with a more politically important cause that might actually help people.

What's your agenda here? You come onto a niche wine board talking about how people can't buy Clos Roche Blanche in Illinois. In reality, it is available in that state because we have a distributor there who buys it for the same price our distributor in New York buys the wines.

As a licensed importer and a licensed distributor I am for an end to all restrictive federal and state legislation involving wine sales, even if it financially hurts me.

But let me assure no millions of dollars are being made on these wines. Money is being made on brand wines, but who really cares?

Again, I'd like to know your agenda here. Consumers don't happen to know Maverick salespeople.

You write:

Millions are being made on *every* *single* *bottle* of alcohol that must pass through their monopoly. Every critter labled bottle. Every bottle of Ghost horse. All of them, without exception. If there are not millions being made, how can IL distributors afford to have given $3.5 million in political contributions in just the last five years?

What argument can you make that supports the funding and lobbying that the distributors have mustered to support this law that does not end up with legislating their profit margin?

Let me assure you that the critter bottles would be nowhere if it wasn't for the legislated three-tier-system.

3.5 million dollars is bubkes, as my cousin, Dr. Barbara Hirsch the famous Great Endocrinologist would put it.

Again, what do you do for a living?
 
originally posted by Bill Bounds:
Or perhaps it is just a power thing of not wanting to give up anything that they currently have. Whatever their motivation there is no denying the role that distributing/wholesale sector has had in fighting tooth and nail to prevent legislation and fight judicial cases to limit sales of wine.

This isn't a problem in New York, but there are lots of other markets that can't get the wines that they would like to drink at any price and others where the wines are allocated and when available at a much higher price. For example, the 2001 and 2002 Gang of Four beaujolais were very difficult to find at any Atlanta wine store. If you could find them, prices were $32 to 34 per bottle vs. NYC prices of $20.

Good luck, Marc.

Bill Bounds
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Atlanta has one of the worst state wine and liquor regulatory set-ups. Along with other states like Virginia, it is a franchise state. So, Kermit cannot stop selling to a particular wholesaler because the wholesaler has earned the rights to the wine.

In other states, the importer or national agent can change without state involvement. The Atlanta laws are truly horrible and should certainly be overthrown.

But part of the "monopoly" would occur in even a "free-trade economy." For instance, if an Atlanta based distributor decides to buy a large quantity from Kermit, they would not want their competition offering the exact same wine bought at the same price. They would demand some form of exclusivity, even if it not dracnoian, as would their customers who take large quantities. This is just normal capitalism.

My point in this discussion is to be concrete and not paint broad strokes about evil wholesalers and evil lobbyists.
 
Joe,

With all due respect, I am not the boogey-man you're trying to make me out to be. I work for the Court Theatre in Chicago (check it out - we're doing a new adaptation/translation of Ibsen's 'The Wild Duck' - pretty cool!) - it's a non-profit, I'm the director of production. I love drinking the wines you import because I find a high value at a low price, and low price is important because I earn a non-profit salary.

I've posted on a niche wine board because I like this board, and have gotten a lot out of it, even before it became Wine Disorder. I think people might be interested, and any avenue to bring people to this cause is an open one to me. I've posted elsewhere, as well (which I'm sure you've seen).

You have managed to blow my Clos Roche Blanche comment (made to get in good with the rest of the disorderlies) into a lovely strawman argument, but that's not what I've said, and you know that.

I know Maverick salespeople because they come and pour tasting at my favorite local bottle shop, Red & White. Where, coincidentally, I buy my CRB.

$3.5 Million may be bubkis, but it is the most from any single industry in IL over that time period, so I think that counts for something. I'm informed, well read and well researched, and I care about this issue. If, indeed, you are, and I quote:
"...for an end to all restrictive federal and state legislation involving wine sales, even if it financially hurts me."
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then please, we could use your voice, or your dollars as we try to amend HR 429.

I'm not trying to end hunger, that's my wife's job at the Greater Chicago Food Depository. I'll let Bill Gates take care of the rest.

Best,

-Marc
 
What I want to know concretely is what wines can't you buy in Chicago?

At times our company imports 25 case lots of wine and obviously they can't be everywhere in the country if there are only 300 bottles. But you can buy from Chambers Street, the Garagiste or Crush if you get there fast enough by e-mail. No one is going to stop you and you know this is the case.

What's your objection to how the critter sales are handled? Do you really care?

Yes, it is a ridiculous law which ought to be ended. But so what?

By the way, I have no idea what other boards you post on. I've never seen you here except with this fake appeal to save the Clos Roche Blanche for the poor citizens of Illinois. Pretty sly and pretty cynical, if you ask me. I didn't create the straw man, you did.

How much are you charging to see Ibsen's Wild Duck?

So, please be concrete is your concern that you can't get some Cult wine from a retailer in California.

More importantly, why don't you call for and to all legislated sales and enable the consumer to buy directly from the producer anywhere in the world? Why privilege retailers?
 
I, for one, would like to know more about this production of 'Wild Duck' and why it's not available here in San Francisco. Is the three-tier system preventing Ibsen from making it to California?
 
Did someone say that the three-tier system was restricting distribution of Cold Duck? Now I'm really pissed.
 
You know, I kind of liked the squabbling with Joe Perry better, at least he fought back.

Although I complained about that, too. I guess there's no pleasing some people.
 
originally posted by Scott Kraft:
I, for one, would like to know more about this production of 'Wild Duck' and why it's not available here in San Francisco. Is the three-tier system preventing Ibsen from making it to California?
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I just checked on the the Court Theatre's web site and it will cost a family of four $152.00 to see Ibsen's Wild Duck!

And that's not including popcorn and Cracker Jacks!

You could buy a case of Clos Roche Blanche for that money and that's using the three-tier system.

My question is how much of that $38.00 goes into the pockets of the actors and how much goes to enrich the pockets of the Chicago Theatre Robber Barons?

Even if the actors get a large portion of the proceeds, why is Laura Scheinbaum (one of the actresses) entitled to bigger money than Catherine Roussel?

I sent a check for $30.00 to your ridiculous organization.
 
originally posted by Joe Dressner:
I sent the $30.00 to the Illinois Wine Consumers Coalition. They won't give me a seat to anything.
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Maybe they'll tell you what the little guy on the left in the picture on their website said to the girl to make her look like that.
 
originally posted by lars makie:
originally posted by Joe Dressner:
I sent the $30.00 to the Illinois Wine Consumers Coalition. They won't give me a seat to anything.
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Maybe they'll tell you said the little guy on the left in the picture on their website said to the girl to make her look like that.
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"We're going to Ibsen's 'Wild Duck' after this."
 
I just looked and the script is available for free on Google Books!

I misunderstood the ticket pricing policy. The tickets I looked at were for the preview. The regular run will cost $38 to $60.00.

I assume that the the regular $38.00 seats are the equivalent of bleacher seats and all the fat cat wholesalers will be in the superior $60.00 spots.

I'm boycotting the whole event and will be watching Ingrid Bergman in Ibsen's Hedda Gabler for free on YouTube.
 
Dammit. All I wanted was a hearty Fuck You from the monkey, a welcome to the best place on the internet to discuss tokay as seen through the lens of a dead Norwegian playright, and a little moment in the sun for the IWCC.

I don't have the chops to keep up, so I'll take my last comment to Joe off to a private message, and leave it at that.

Perhaps I'll have the balls to post a corroborating tasting note when the opportunity presents itself.

Back to my over-priced, distributor backed hoity-toity arts!

-Marc
 
originally posted by Joe Dressner:
I just looked and the script is available for free on Google Books!

I misunderstood the ticket pricing policy. The tickets I looked at were for the preview. The regular run will cost $38 to $60.00.

I assume that the the regular $38.00 seats are the equivalent of bleacher seats and all the fat cat wholesalers will be in the superior $60.00 spots.

I'm boycotting the whole event and will be watching Ingrid Bergman in Ibsen's Hedda Gabler for free on YouTube.
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I have a preference for Master Builder.
 
originally posted by Marc Stubblefield:
Dammit. All I wanted was a hearty Fuck You from the monkey, a welcome to the best place on the internet to discuss tokay as seen through the lens of a dead Norwegian playright, and a little moment in the sun for the IWCC.

I don't have the chops to keep up, so I'll take my last comment to Joe off to a private message, and leave it at that.

Perhaps I'll have the balls to post a corroborating tasting note when the opportunity presents itself.

Back to my over-priced, distributor backed hoity-toity arts!

-Marc
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Did you bother to read before you posted?
 
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