Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
Agreed, time does seem to allow some submerged factors to reassert themselves, at least to some extent.
This and That.
- Thread starter Jeff Grossman
- Start date
Agreed, time does seem to allow some submerged factors to reassert themselves, at least to some extent.
Jeff Grossman
Jeff Grossman
Defaix seems to be totally 'on' in recent vintages. (Yes, six years is still recent.)
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
This Cinsault from centenary own-rooted vines is such a joy to drink that I opened a second upon finishing the first (on day 3, but, until the recent decrease in drinking volume, no bottle of this caliber would have survived the evening unfinished). The (red) fruitiness is complex, vivid, and youthfully gorgeous, plus there's no semi-carbonic sameness to contend with. If you seen any in your neck of the woods, run, don't walk. You'll thank me and forget about Europe for an evening or two or three.
Florida Jim
Florida Jim
That vineyard has sourced several excellent Cinsaults and each has been excellent in its own way.
Birichino is surely one.
Birichino is surely one.
Jeff Grossman
Jeff Grossman
Birichino on the label is almost always a guarantee of a good wine inside.
scottreiner
scott reiner
What Jeff said!
I even like their Zin and Cab wines.
Florida Jim
Florida Jim
2022 Dom. Christian Clerget, Chambolle-Musigny - showing very young and unformed but so distinctly Chambolle as to make me smile. Needs 8-10 years if you ask me and has the depth of a premier cru.
I used to drink Chambolle as often as I could but prices have become obscene, much Burgundy is a crap-shoot and I have diversified my tastes. Yet there is nothing like fine Burgundy and I have missed it.
This producer is new to me and pretty impressive. (Any background would be appreciated.)
Regardless, this is what I want when it comes to this AOC and with time, I anticipate a chance for a true “Burgundy experience;” if you know, you know.
Fine wine.
I used to drink Chambolle as often as I could but prices have become obscene, much Burgundy is a crap-shoot and I have diversified my tastes. Yet there is nothing like fine Burgundy and I have missed it.
This producer is new to me and pretty impressive. (Any background would be appreciated.)
Regardless, this is what I want when it comes to this AOC and with time, I anticipate a chance for a true “Burgundy experience;” if you know, you know.
Fine wine.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
Sounds lovely, will be on the lookout.
Karen Goetz
Karen Goetz
Jim,
Christian Clerget's 1993 Chambolle-Musigny was the moment I fell in love with the reds of Bourgogne. I was lucky to also find 1996 C. Clerget Chambolle-Musigny "Les Charmes" and 1996 Echezeaux Grand Cru. Found them all at vintage release. I started opening them 8 to 10 years after vintage and continued for several years after that; increasing complexity and continued freshness and music. Echezeaux last opened 2014 and it was superb; maybe my most astonishing and lovely bourgogne ever tasted. Wonderful with the right food. Chambolle-Musigny "Les Charmes" last opened 2015. Especial pleasure and focus on floral, stony, spicy elements in the Echezeaux. Reading over the notes I made on these beauties is like remembering a symphony that once heard, never leaves you.
I've lost track of importer/distributor and haven't seen them for years in the Bay Area.
Lucky you!
Florida Jim
Florida Jim
Thanks Karen.
I searched a little but it’s mostly who, where, when answers so this helps.
This bottle reminded me of just how good Chambolle can be - it had been awhile since anything left that impression. Even a few Mugnier and Roumier wines over the years didn’t leave the impression this did.
I’m sure there are several producers that compete with or even surpass this producer but this bottle certainly gave me the feeling that, held long enough, the gods would smile.
I searched a little but it’s mostly who, where, when answers so this helps.
This bottle reminded me of just how good Chambolle can be - it had been awhile since anything left that impression. Even a few Mugnier and Roumier wines over the years didn’t leave the impression this did.
I’m sure there are several producers that compete with or even surpass this producer but this bottle certainly gave me the feeling that, held long enough, the gods would smile.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
This was a bit of a mixed experience over the course of two evenings. On the liability side it seemed a bit over-extracted, with a mild tannic grip whose slightly muddled granularity felt closer to sediment (though the bottle stood upright for more than a day). Overall, not very friendly, even somewhat grumpy, with a low charm-school score. On the asset side, though, there were a few unguarded moments when the package came together in a suddenly satisfying way. All in all, neither pleaser nor poseur. May have been the victim of cellar interventions that have come home to roost like a damaged childhood, but managed to contribute a few moments of engrossing conversation.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
Had a better bottle of the same two years ago, though still with a hint of oak, which this didn't show.
Can't say anything for sure, but the higher than usual extraction (for a 1er Cru Burg) made me suspect that this might have been chaptalized to prolong fermentation. The higher than usual tannins may have come from the % of new or newish oak barrels. Both with possible repercussions to the body.
I think the new oak is pretty limited (less than 30%) and his wines have never struck me as 'oaky' (although not sure I've tasted this one). But I'm sure all kinds of things could go wrong in such a vintage. And, as I've noted repeatedly, I've not had the best luck with aging Louis Boillot wines across many 'better' vintages, struggling to find the moment when they show their best.
2010 Brovia Barolo was opened last night while waiting for the single vineyard wines to unclench. In a very nice place right now, balancing the remaining dark cherry fruit with the tertiary notes of earth and leather. Very silky tannins and the bricking at the rim indicate that now is a good time to start drinking these up. This was definitely singing in a low register, mostly bass notes with no high toned notes in the nose.
Mark Lipton
Mark Lipton
Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
I'll leave any speculation that touches on wine chemistry to those of you who, unlike yours truly, actually earned a middle school diploma. However I did taste the 11s extensively from barrel and, from door to door, decisions regarding whether to chaptalize or not - given low natural sugars - varied wildly as did the underlying reasoning or lack thereof. Beyond obvious concerns about sanitation, you got everything from "there is nothing wrong with an under-12% bonnes mares" to "it's not grand cru if it's not above 13%." I don't know if, in this forum, we have ever debated whether it's possible to detect chaptalization in bottle, all other things being equal. Mark may remember if we have, but best guess is barring detectability of byproducts it would be hard to tell the difference. But other things aren't equal in 2011, and this is where I willingly enter the realm of personal taste. Perhaps as a certified Loire head, while I recognize the greenness aka some underripeness of phenolic material in '11 red burgs, I don't find the wines out of balance as long as they are modest in perceived ripeness. Where the bigger, and presumably chaptalized, wines from that vintage fail me is in juxtaposition of riper flavors with greener herbaceous dry extracts. To that extent, I can also sympathize with the complaint [cited above] regarding prolonged fermentation given somewhat underripe tannins to begin with.
I recall a discussion, initiated by yours truly, about the curious phenomenon of a decidedly red-fruited Drouhin Chorey taking on darker colors and darker fruit notes with increased bottle age. Fatboy weighed in with the view that such behavior was indicative of Chaptalization. I know of folks, including IIRC Keith Levenberg, who can tell the difference between Coca-Cola sweetened with cane sugar vs that sweetened with HFCS, so I suppose some might be able to distinguish wine fermented from glucose from that fermented from a mix of glucose and sucrose. Mark Lipton
Claude Kolm
Claude Kolm
I think you can tell fairly easily the difference between over-chaptalized and not over-chaptalized. I really can't imagine that you can tell the difference between chaptalized (a little) and not. If chaptalization affects the color, please enlighten me.