NWR: Beethoven Recordings

Nice to see Hermann Scherchen mentioned on these pages. When I was growing up, my father often played his performances of the Bach b minor Mass, the St. Matthew's Passion, and Beethoven's 9th. I think the 9th is very good, though the orchestra is not the best and the singers are somewhat slack. On an only vaguely related note, I have a CD of Scherchen conducting an astonishing performance of the Dvorak Cello concerto with Pierre Fournier as the celloist and the RTSI orchestra. Fournier plays with far more emotion and power than he usually does, and Scherchen, who I think did not record another Dvorak piece, is at the top of his form both in the Dvorak and in the Brahms 3rd Symphony on the b-side.
 
originally posted by Andrew Zachary:

Nice to see Hermann Scherchen mentioned on these pages. When I was growing up, my father often played his performances of the Bach b minor Mass, the St. Matthew's Passion, and Beethoven's 9th. I think the 9th is very good, though the orchestra is not the best and the singers are somewhat slack. On an only vaguely related note, I have a CD of Scherchen conducting an astonishing performance of the Dvorak Cello concerto with Pierre Fournier as the celloist and the RTSI orchestra. Fournier plays with far more emotion and power than he usually does, and Scherchen, who I think did not record another Dvorak piece, is at the top of his form both in the Dvorak and in the Brahms 3rd Symphony on the b-side.
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Wow! (That was available on CD (Westminster?) - how did I miss that...) I'd love to hear that one. Fournier's recording of the same piece with Szell and the Berliners may be my favourite version (apart from the historic Casals and Feuermann recordings). By the way, when it comes to Scherchen, one might want to add his Beethoven Eroica and 8th, Haydn Farewell and Military (recorded twice) Symphonies, Khachaturian Gayaneh, Tchaikovsky 1812 and both (!) recordings of Mozart's Requiem.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
 
Thanks, Andrew, I will keep an eye out for the Dvorak. And David, I agree with you that Scherchen's talent extended beyond Beethoven, though I find him strongest on familiar works, where his freshness of approach compensates for the perhaps lesser quality of his performers. His Beethoven 8th goes a long way, in my mind, towards confirming the greatness of this often overlooked symphony.
 
originally posted by David from Switzerland:

... As to the second paragraph, I wasn't aware you were asking about anything other than the String Quartets ...
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I started with the quartets, with the vain idea of holding onto a few dollars for Burgundy. The volume information so generously provided in this thread, though, is such that I'll have to archive and re-read it several times over the coming year.

Beethoven OR Burgundy? Come on! What about food? Body care? Anything's dispensable... ;^)
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Yes, well, I'm already eating a lot more steamed frozen vegetables than I used to :{.

Thanks again.
 
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
Wow, great suggestions. Pehaps one of you would be willing to assign points to the different recordings so I know what to buy. I presume the Budapest recordings should be 90-95, at least. Perhaps we could have an off-line and do some blind listening, you know, a Beethoven orchestra shoot-out. I really need to know which is the best!
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Eh, just go for the most expensive recording. That should be the best ;)
 
Yes; Joe Dougherty has instructed me that this is the Plotnicki ranking system, modified from the original 1855 Bordeaux classification system. Works equally well in all commercial contexts.
 
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:

Yes; Joe Dougherty has instructed me that this is the Plotnicki ranking system, modified from the original 1855 Bordeaux classification system. Works equally well in all commercial contexts.
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Well, irony aside, I can assure you that while it only works one way when it comes to fine wine (= that it's costly doesn't mean it must be good, but chances are, if it's really good, it ain't cheap), there's no such rule when it comes to classical music whatsover.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
 
Nonsense. Another good rule is to buy the recording with the heaviest packaging, or with package shapes/sizes that won't fit in your CD rack, which works even better with classical music than it does with wine.
 
... there's no such rule when it comes to classical music whatsover.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
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I just purchased the Kleiber recording, at about $12, so I'll be testing your corollary this evening!

originally posted by Thor:
Nonsense. Another good rule is to buy the recording with the heaviest packaging, or with package shapes/sizes that won't fit in your CD rack, which works even better with classical music than it does with wine.
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Rats, Thor. By posting NWR I was hoping to fly under your radar.
 
originally posted by Thor:
Nonsense. Another good rule is to buy the recording with the heaviest packaging, or with package shapes/sizes that won't fit in your CD rack, which works even better with classical music than it does with wine.
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On reflection this actually has some merit...

F
 
Actually, the best recording is the one that comes in the plastic/titanium packaging you can't open. It's just like that bottle of wine so expensive there's never a right time to open it. Both just have to be good.
 
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:

I just purchased the Kleiber recording, at about $12, so I'll be testing your corollary this evening!
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Kleiber son, the DG Originals CD of Beethoven's 5th and 7th, I suppose? Not a good example, that CD may be considered a bargain at any price. If you like it, get his live 4th on Orfeo next. And note there is an Amsterdam live 7th on DVD, too.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
 
When I first started collecting classical music the major labels ran around $2.99 with imports going for $3.99. You usually got 40 minutes of music on a medium that had to be handled with kid gloves and started showing wear and tear after a few playings (but the sound, when done correctly, was better). Would that wine prices had done the same.

And while we are on Beethoven symphonies, my favorite is the 7th especially the Toscanini with the New York Philharmonic Symphony Orchestra and the Casals with the Marlboro Festival Orchestra.
 
originally posted by Dan Donahue:
When I first started collecting classical music the major labels ran around $2.99 with imports going for $3.99.
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Burgundy must have been selling for about the same price back then, too, no? :)
 
originally posted by Claude Kolm:

Burgundy must have been selling for about the same price back then, too, no? :)
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Reminds of when one time someone asked about the provenance of a bottle from the 1961 vintage, I told my company at the table I'd bought the wine on subscription, relating in great detail how I picked it up myself at the Chteau and carted it home using an old military style bicycle - no one even blinked, and I could swear I saw someone nod away out of the corner of my eye...

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
 
Coming late to the party, but Karajan's 1977 version of the 9th is my standard (though the '63 version is also lovely), though I have more recordings of the 9th than I have bottles of Donnhoff (or nearly so). Harnoncourt did a symphony cycle that straddled the line between old school funereal pacing and modern "get 'em out in time for the 4th quarter of the ball game" style. I like it very much.

No comments on the Piano Sonatas so far, so I will plug Richard Goode, as well as the Schnabel set that David from Switzerland convinced me to buy.

As far as the much-discussed quartets go - nothing more to add to the confusion. I once bought the set by the Tokyo String Quartet, but only listened through one time. It's not very good.
 
originally posted by David M. Bueker:

Coming late to the party, but Karajan's 1977 version of the 9th is my standard (though the '63 version is also lovely), though I have more recordings of the 9th than I have bottles of Donnhoff (or nearly so). Harnoncourt did a symphony cycle that straddled the line between old school funereal pacing and modern "get 'em out in time for the 4th quarter of the ball game" style. I like it very much.
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More recordings of Beethoven's 9th than bottles of Dnnhoff? Same here! My favourites at this point in my life include Furtwngler's top three live performances: Lucerne 1954, Berlin 1942 and - although clearly to a lesser extent - Bayreuth 1951; Tennstedt's live performance from London 1985; Maag live in Padova 1994; Leibowitz's (1961) and Toscanini's (1952) studio classics; others I've re-acquainted myself with at least once last year include Fricsay's (1958) and Wand's (1986 NDR) studio recordings. In other words not a symphony I listened to particularly often in the past year. ;^)

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
 
originally posted by David M. Bueker:

Yeah, but in your case it's only Brucke Gold Kap.
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VdP-Auction Eiswein, what about icewine?! ;^) But seriously, the only Dnnhoff I remember ever having bought more than a sixpack of was a Kirschheck Sptlese. Didn't last long, that case, though. The Beethoven Ninths are still here, really one of the major advantages, I'd say.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
 
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