Loire 2005 at the tgjp

P

pab

pierre-alain benoit
Hello,
We made a great dinner at the tgjp in Paris last friday with Loire 2005 : whites from Gu d'Orger & Chidaine, reds from Fosses Seches, Sebastien David, Couly-Dutheil, Bernard Baudry & Philippe Alliet. See tgjp.com
Ask any questions on the forum and I will try to answer.
Best regards.
pierre-alain benoit
 
Sorry to hear you didn't enjoy the Burgundy but it sounds like you had a couple of good wines. Although that St Nicholas bottle was indeed horrible! Marketing gone awry.
 
Hello Rahsaan,
This dinner brought us 3 news :
- Sadly, Sebastien David is more a wanabee than a new commer. Good work in the vineyard (organic), but "too much" work in the cellar. And the marketing...
- Baudry & Alliet still produce superb wines
- Chidaine is on the bad side of the hill. I think he produce too many wines (more than 30 ha).
Best regards
pierre-alain
 
Lovely writeup. Makes me want to run out and buy a bottle of Alliet (...I've already got the Croix Boisee sleeping in the cellar).
 
Chidaine is on the bad side of the hill. I think he produce too many wines (more than 30 ha).
Best regards
pierre-alain
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So these 'problems' continue in 06 and 07? The complaint about sweetness was understandable for a vintage like 05, but one would hope for more tension and focus in 07, for example.
 
I tasted the 06 last month (Choisilles & Vouvray) & they were also disapointed. It's a "secret de polichinelle" in Montlouis but Chidaine expended too fast his production.
best regards
pierre-alain
 
It's a "secret de polichinelle" in Montlouis but Chidaine expended too fast his production.
best regards
pierre-alain
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Tough stuff. One the positive side, he now has access to some good sites. So I guess the choice is either to jettison the 'weaker' sites or hire a larger staff :)
 
thanks for the nice write-up - i like your approach and the very developed sense of hierarchy and functions within your little club. i am just wondering if you weren't a bit rough on the vouvray by trying to pair it with some cochonailles ... after all, it is off-dry, young and from a rather powerful vintage.

did you try the vouvray with the plateau de fromages? this would have been instinctively the place where i see it having a chance to "show off" in your line-up of food.
 
I went through quite a few bottles of the 2005 Montlouis Bournais, which was excellent. I also think that great things will come from the Clos Boudoin down the line.

I find Francois intelligent and serious and think he makes very good wines. Are his Vouvray up to the level of Huet and Foreau? No, but that's holding the bar a little high IMO.
 
originally posted by The Fish:
Vouvraythanks for the nice write-up - i like your approach and the very developed sense of hierarchy and functions within your little club. i am just wondering if you weren't a bit rough on the vouvray by trying to pair it with some cochonailles ... after all, it is off-dry, young and from a rather powerful vintage.

did you try the vouvray with the plateau de fromages? this would have been instinctively the place where i see it having a chance to "show off" in your line-up of food.
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First time, I tasted the Chidaine without food. In a second times with the cochonnailles. Like you wrotte, it was clearly the a bad wedding : fat + fat. I will try another bottle next month.
Best regards.
pierre-alain benoit
 
originally posted by VLM:
ChidaineI went through quite a few bottles of the 2005 Montlouis Bournais, which was excellent. I also think that great things will come from the Clos Boudoin down the line.

I find Francois intelligent and serious and think he makes very good wines. Are his Vouvray up to the level of Huet and Foreau? No, but that's holding the bar a little high IMO.
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I appreciate your position (very close to main members of this board). But to my mind, Huet & Foreau aren't qualitativ leader (too much sulfur and too less wine) and Vouvray is closer to a mythe (born in the middle of the XIX century) than a reality. In 3 or 5 years, US fan will understand...
Sadly, the Montlouis revolution is a little bit not so explosiv than expected.
Try to taste a Stphane Cossais Volagr 2004 or 2005.
Best regards
pierre-alain
 
originally posted by pab:
Vouvray is closer to a mythe (born in the middle of the XIX century) than a reality. In 3 or 5 years, US fan will understand...
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For the impatient fans who don't want to wait 5 years, could you tell us a bit more about what you mean by "mythe?"
 
originally posted by politburo:
originally posted by pab:
main members of this board
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Who are these people who claim to be "main members?"
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Sorry camarade,
My english is too poor. I just wanted to say "most of the members".
Best regards
pierre-alain
 
Oui... mais on aimerait plutt savoir pourquoi tu dis que le vouvray, c'est plus un mythe qu'une ralit, quand mme... et que nous, on aura le fin mot de l'histoire en 5 ans ! Pauvres Amricains de nous.

[Restating SFJoe's question.]
 
originally posted by SFJoe:
originally posted by pab:
Vouvray is closer to a mythe (born in the middle of the XIX century) than a reality. In 3 or 5 years, US fan will understand...
Click to expand...
For the impatient fans who don't want to wait 5 years, could you tell us a bit more about what you mean by "mythe?"
Click to expand...

Vouvray is a sleeping AOC : no wanabee, no rebirth... Everybody told you : "It's a marvelous terroir !". But since ten years, I drank Huet, Foreau, Pinon, I never drank a whaouuu bottle. Montlouis mouve (Saumon, Cossais & Preiskopf), Vouvray still sleep. People say in Vouvray than Hwang won't keep the estate.
Best regards.
pierre-alain benoit
 
Montlouis mouve (Saumon, Cossais & Preiskopf), Vouvray still sleep.
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While I can understand critiques of Vouvray or Loire chenin in general (everyone is allowed their own taste) I'm not sure I follow the idea that Montlouis is so much better than Vouvray. I've only had Cossais out of those three names, so perhaps I'm not the most qualified to speak, but it didn't seem miles ahead of the Vouvray names. (In fact, it seemed a little behind, but I'm speaking from a limited sample)

Anyway, interesting ideas, will be curious to see what develops in the region.
 
Pardon, mais pab, ton chauvinisme de base me dgote. Les Amricains d'aujourd'hui n'ont pas de retard, surtout ceux qui frquentent ce forum. Certains, figure-toi, sont bien plus cals que toi.
 
originally posted by Rahsaan:
Montlouis mouve (Saumon, Cossais & Preiskopf), Vouvray still sleep.
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While I can understand critiques of Vouvray or Loire chenin in general (everyone is allowed their own taste) I'm not sure I follow the idea that Montlouis is so much better than Vouvray. I've only had Cossais out of those three names, so perhaps I'm not the most qualified to speak, but it didn't seem miles ahead of the Vouvray names. (In fact, it seemed a little behind, but I'm speaking from a limited sample)

Anyway, interesting ideas, will be curious to see what develops in the region.
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There is the good question. What is the most important : terroir or vigneron ? Who can say that terroir of Vouvray is superior than terroir of Montlouis ?
There is real fact : Montlouis move, Vouvray sleep.
Best regards
pierre-alain
 
originally posted by Sharon Bowman:
Pardon, mais pab, ton chauvinisme de base me dgote. Les Amricains d'aujourd'hui n'ont pas de retard, surtout ceux qui frquentent ce forum. Certains, figure-toi, sont bien plus cals que toi.
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Hello,
"dgote", keep cool ! It's just wine.
Best regard
pierre-alain benoit
 
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