2007 Clos Roche Blanche Gamay

[MLipton]

originally posted by Jay Miller:

originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:

What do you like about Drouhin, Jay?

It's a combination of style and sentiment. A 1990 Drouhin Bonnes Mares was the wine that converted me to Burgundy. While I've occasionally had disappointing wines from them my success rate is very high. They don't overoak, they don't overripen (usually, Veronique seems to prefer things ever so slightly riper than I do), they do a selection massale, and with age they they develop into classic Burgundy. And they have such a wide range of offerings that it's one can taste a lot of different terroirs. Also, for a long time they were very underpriced for the quality though unfortunately with all the positive reviews prices have escalated a lot in recent years :(.

Count me as another Drouhin apologist. One thing that I've appreciated is that they have some very nice parcels, which are still reasonably priced, probably because of the negoce stigma. I know that quite a few seem to prefer Jadot to Drouhin, if by a whisker, but for my part I find the house style of Drouhin a bit more in my wheelhouse.

Mark Lipton

 

[Jay Miller]

originally posted by MLipton:

Count me as another Drouhin apologist. One thing that I've appreciated is that they have some very nice parcels, which are still reasonably priced, probably because of the negoce stigma. I know that quite a few seem to prefer Jadot to Drouhin, if by a whisker, but for my part I find the house style of Drouhin a bit more in my wheelhouse.

Mark Lipton

Definitely. I've had some Jadots I like very much (e.g., Ursules and Bonnes Mares) but overall I prefer Drouhin. It's a good thing I still like them as I own more of their wines than any other producer (Musar is a distant second).

 

[jack hott]

I'll go in on the Drouhin love. I've had more than a few well-aged examples and have found nothing but quality coming out of this house. I also like Bouchard quite a bit, especially after tasting through their 2006 line-up. I prefer small growers, but when price is an object (and it often is) Drouhin and (to a lesser degree) Bouchard are pretty good.

 

[Ian Fitzsimmons]

Many thanks for the Drouhin elucidations. I've read a series of good things about them lately and wanted to understand the nature of their appeal better. I gather their style tends towards restraint and elegance, which is where my preferences in B'y trend. I suppose I should just get off my heinie and buy a few bottles to try.

Do all y'all find the things you like in their wines to be present at the 'lower' levels as well - say, villages and regional?

 

[MLipton]

originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:

Do all y'all find the things you like in their wines to be present at the 'lower' levels as well - say, villages and regional?

I haven't made a detailed study of this (perhaps Jay has), but the village-level wines I've had have been very much in the same style as their pricier bottlings. Those village-level wines, though, are not likely to come from their own vineyards, but they seem to do a good job of sourcing top quality grapes, too.

Mark Lipton

 

[Jay Miller]

originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
Many thanks for the Drouhin elucidations. I've read a series of good things about them lately and wanted to understand the nature of their appeal better. I gather their style tends towards restraint and elegance, which is where my preferences in B'y trend. I suppose I should just get off my heinie and buy a few bottles to try.

Do all y'all find the things you like in their wines to be present at the 'lower' levels as well - say, villages and regional?

Their best village wine (IMO) is their Chambolle but all the others I've had have been good. And I remember an '88 Vosne villages which Kay opened a few years ago that batted well above its weight.

The Cote de Beaune (not Cote de Beaune villages) is a good value to look for as it's largely declassified Clos des Mouches.

I'll add that the Chambolle 1er Cru while a delicious wine is generally on the riper side than any of their other Chambolles. The Petit Monts (which has been made by Veronique for many years) is also a touch riper. But given that they don't pass my threshhold (which is pretty low) I wouldn't take that as a major caution.

An '06 Pommard recently was sort of disappointing. Not bad but one of those wines where I think "I can drink this but is it really worth the calories?".

 

[Rahsaan]

originally posted by Jay Miller:
I'll add that the Chambolle 1er Cru while a delicious wine is generally on the riper side than any of their other Chambolles.

Is it normal for that wine to cost $100?

 

[Bwood]

originally posted by Jay Miller:
Their best village wine (IMO) is their Chambolle but all the others I've had have been good. And I remember an '88 Vosne villages which Kay opened a few years ago that batted well above its weight.

The Cote de Beaune (not Cote de Beaune villages) is a good value to look for as it's largely declassified Clos des Mouches.

I also like their Chambolle most years. And the Griotte-Chambertin, which I have run across not so long ago at not so bad a price, can be stunning. And I also agree about the Cote de Beaune sometimes being a great value.

Count me in the camp that would definitely buy Drouhin before Jadot.

I do wonder sometimes if some of the Drouhin wines have a bit of sameness that comes not just from having a somewhat consistent approach with respect to ripeness, elevage, etc but maybe also from from using the same yeast, even though when you read the Drouhin press you wouldn't think that is the case.

 

[MarkS]

originally posted by Jay Miller:

originally posted by Dan McQ:
The 2003 CRB Gamay is still a little atypical, but better than when I last had it a year ago.

The '03 CRB reds were surprisingly good. I didn't lay any down which was probably a mistake as I had them pegged as drink early and enjoy.

Really? I drank all of my 3 bottles soon after they came in (around 2005 or so) and was less-than-whelmed after hearing such expletives about the 2002 (which was sold out and I got stuck with the 03's).

I'm still of mixed mind when it comes to the wines of CRB: they seem okay for the price, but speak of nothing special to me or that shouts of fantastic glee.

A question for the CSW crowd: they advertised the 2006 as 'vielle vignes' Cot,
but this was nowhere notated on the bottle. Are there two cot bottlings, or only the one, which happens to come from an old-vine parcel?

 

[SFJoe]

originally posted by MarkS:

the wines of CRB: they seem okay for the price, but speak of nothing special to me or that shouts of fantastic glee.

That's right, nothing to see here, keep moving along.

 

[Saina Nieminen]

originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:

Do all y'all find the things you like in their wines to be present at the 'lower' levels as well - say, villages and regional?

I usually find much to love in their "lower end" wines also. Pommard '96 was just lovely recently and one of the few '05s that I have genuinely enjoyed is their CdN Villages. I even tend to like their Beaujolais Crus though those see little talk here.

-O

 

[Jay Miller]

originally posted by Rahsaan:

originally posted by Jay Miller:
I'll add that the Chambolle 1er Cru while a delicious wine is generally on the riper side than any of their other Chambolles.

Is it normal for that wine to cost $100?

Aaack! Pre-2005 it generally ran about $55. Personally I wouldn't (and didn't) pay $100 for it. Of course my annual Bonnes Mares purchase stopped there as well since it jumped from about $125 to $365.

 

[Rahsaan]

originally posted by Jay Miller:
Aaack! Pre-2005 it generally ran about $55. Personally I wouldn't (and didn't) pay $100 for it.

Aaack indeed!

I don't know what release prices were, but right now I see the 05 Chambolle for $60 and the 05 Chambolle 1er for $100.

Aaack indeed!

 

[Jay Miller]

originally posted by Rahsaan:

originally posted by Jay Miller:
Aaack! Pre-2005 it generally ran about $55. Personally I wouldn't (and didn't) pay $100 for it.

Aaack indeed!

I don't know what release prices were, but right now I see the 05 Chambolle for $60 and the 05 Chambolle 1er for $100.

Aaack indeed!

Over the years I used to pay around $35-$45 for the villages and 55-60 for the 1er (didn't buy any '05 1er). '05 pricing isn't really Burgundy pricing it's "what will people pay for the vintage of the century?" pricing. The dollar didn't help either.

 

[Jeff Connell]

originally posted by Jay Miller:
Their best village wine (IMO) is their Chambolle but all the others I've had have been good. And I remember an '88 Vosne villages which Kay opened a few years ago that batted well above its weight.

The Cote de Beaune (not Cote de Beaune villages) is a good value to look for as it's largely declassified Clos des Mouches.

But speaking of their Cte de Beaune Villages, it is generally one of the best values among Burgundy. The 2006, for $20, is quite decent.

 

[Jay Miller]

The 2001 Muller Catoir Haardter Burgergarten Riesling Spatlese 2133 is in a nice place right now, developed beautifully over the course of the evening moving from rich and delicious but a rather closed nose to expansively open nose and a gorgeous melange of pit fruit to eventually showing some grapefruit notes. I'll wait a few years for my next one but if you have a few of them it's a fun check-in.

The 2005 Edmunds St. John Wylie Fenaughty was excellent though I think double decanting in the morning rather than the night before would have had it closer to maximum enjoyment of its current young state. It was starting to show some tobacco notes that intruded ever so slightly onto the beautiful aromatics and lithe fruit.

 

[David M. Bueker]

Locally the Drouhin Chambolle 1er Cru is $79.99 (with no tax). The increase is partly but not totally dollar related. Of course I do not expect the '06 or '07 to come down despite fiscal carnage.

And on the negotiant discussion, I prefer Jadot, but that's where I started, so it makes sense. I developed a taste for their style.

 

[Jay Miller]

originally posted by David M. Bueker:
Locally the Drouhin Chambolle 1er Cru is $79.99 (with no tax). The increase is partly but not totally dollar related. Of course I do not expect the '06 or '07 to come down despite fiscal carnage.

And on the negotiant discussion, I prefer Jadot, but that's where I started, so it makes sense. I developed a taste for their style.

I like many Jadot but their style really does stand out. In a blind 2000 Clos Vougeot horizontal I organized the only bottle that everyone was certain of (and were right about) was the Jadot.

 

[David M. Bueker]

Again probably because I started with Jadot, the house style does not stick out for me, but rather other house styles do. For example, I like Drouhin (a lot), but find the oakiness to be a marker.

 

[Joel Stewart]

popped the 04 touraine sauv b #2 last night after coming home from a gig....evidently i liked it, cuz half the bottle was gone before i hit the hay. on second tasting today i'd say it's not bad. it took a little time for a bit of the weird nose to blow off and now is showing correct grape notes. not being a sb fan, it's hard to rate, but sort of boring to be honest.