Cayron & Pierre Andr at the tgjp

I also don't get any new oak on the Raspail-Ay. I drink the European Gour de Chaule there and would be happy to get it here. The last I bought here was in 01 and it tasted like theirs. We'll see what happens with the 07.

Moulin de la Gardette's Ventebrun does see oak. I break my own rules and like it despite that, especially when its more than 5 years old. When they are young, I tend to prefer the base cuvee because of the wood. K&L, is according to them, their only importer into the US. I've never seen it in DC. Where did you find it Ian?
 
I just looked at a site that says that Raspail-Ay does put the wine in smaller barrels after it is in foudre for 18-24 months. I can't find how old the barrels are, but I'd say that this shows Claude to be more sensitive to new wood than either me or Cliff.
 
I think he uses a mix of vessels that are all old, in general. There could be a special cuve de Berkeley for all I know. They show up at Chambers from time to time, but I'm there (in France) enough that I just drink them in France. I've been known to find oak in wines, northern Syrah, where Claude can't ;)
 
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
His reputation is ultra-traditional, slow-evolving.
Click to expand...

I didn't know Raspail-Ay even had a reputation outside of Gigondas. There, indeed, the reputation is traditionalist, but, in Claude's defense, given what much of the rest of Gigondas looks like these days, one can be known as a traditionalist just by resisting having a special cuvee made in 100% new oak, named fut chene.

Although I have been a fan of Raspail-Ay for a long time, I have also found them quite variable. They made nice wines in 98 and 01, so-so wines in between, and between 01 and 07, the only wine I liked much was the 05. To be fair, between 01 and 05, and really since 01, it has gotten harder and harder to find old-style Gigondas's and the ones that were around, for some reason, didn't seem to do well in those years. One can find a couple of more over there than one finds over here, or finds regularly, but still, few enough.
 
You're a tougher critic than I am. I loved the 2001 and think 04, 05, and 07 are very nice. It is tough to find authentic versions nowadays.
 
originally posted by Cliff:
You're a tougher critic than I am. I loved the 2001 and think 04, 05, and 07 are very nice. It is tough to find authentic versions nowadays.
Click to expand...

Not so much tougher. We only seem to disagree on the 04. And I think I may like the 07 more than you do as I would group it with the 95, 98 and 01. If you are also espousing 99, 00 and 03, then maybe I am tougher.
 
I've had trouble getting a read on the 2007 up to this point. I can't see putting it with 2001 yet, but maybe. I didn't have 1998 on release.
 
Ian had a wonderful description of Cayron post 97. I think they need to burn down the cellar and just start over. There is some funky shit in that place. It's really a shame, because old Cayron is terrific.

I keep being disappointed by Pallieres - I think it's going to be great based on Kermit's write ups, but then it doesn't come through. I'm not sure what's going down. Maybe ultimately just the terroir. Maybe it will age into something; I'm holding out for that.

My favorite current Gigondas producer is the Bouissiere normal cuvee - great stuff.
 
I thought Bouissire was great in 2003 but haven't been able to finish more than a glass or two of subsequent vintages.

I don't know when Cayron turned a corner; the more recent bottles I've had haven't been too funky, just too ripe and formless.
 
You could be right. I've got one more of the 2004 in the interest of science. I'm not optimistic based on my last taste, but I've been wrong more than once.
 
Bouissiere has never done it for me. But I've never had more than a taste at the Caveau. Maybe I should visit a bottle.

I think the turning point at Cayron may have been the death of the old man, Faraud (Gabriel?). But the winemaking hasn't changed as far as I know.

The Pallieres is OK, but goopy. They are doing something in terms of ripening or elevage, but it beats me as to what it is.

I liked St. Damien in 01 and 05. It has gotten stratospheric Parker ratings since then and Cambie has arrived. Both bad signs. But they may still be good. Cambie has arrived at Domaine de la Garrigue, and I still like their wines--except for a weird new special cuvee of the Vacqueyras.

I've only tried Bourjasot recently, but I liked their normal cuvee. There are a few new ones who may be worth following yet.
 
I think Grenache typically comes around pretty quickly in the general scheme of things and typically like them best at around 7-12yrs or so.
 
Right you are, as usual. I have this vague notion that traditionally-made ones start loosening up around 10 years, but I can't cite sources.
 
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
Right you are, as usual. I have this vague notion that traditionally-made ones start loosening up around 10 years, but I can't cite sources.
Click to expand...

I agree with Cliff as well, though I have had Gigs at 15 that have done well. My problem with the Les Pallieres, in any case, isn't that they are mute, it's that I haven't liked them young. Maybe they'll go through a magical transformation, but what would be the signs of that? Others do like them, just as others like Santa Duc's Hautes Garrigues. They will no doubt like them with age on them.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top