Asimov on Crozes

M

MLipton

Mark Lipton
Eric Asimov weighs in on Crozes:

link

Their top choice (Mucyn) I've never heard of, but then come the Usual Suspects. It's heartening to read the description of Maxime Graillot's Dom. des Lises, but then again winegrrrrl had already given us the heads up.

Mark Lipton
 
never tried maxime graillot's wine, but i just can't get behind alain's crozes. it just seems so boring. it always seems balanced, ie plenty of acid, but there is no spark to me...
 
originally posted by MLipton:
Asimov on CrozesEric Asimov weighs in on Crozes:

link

Their top choice (Mucyn) I've never heard of, but then come the Usual Suspects. It's heartening to read the description of Maxime Graillot's Dom. des Lises, but then again winegrrrrl had already given us the heads up.

Mark Lipton
Click to expand...

Is the quality level of Graillot's 2009s a common occurrence in the region/vintage?
 
Graillot's issue is the source. Flatlands. Northern Crozes is a whole different deal. Where are the Lises vineyards?
 
I'm a big fan of Graillot's Crozes and especially the Guiraude. I keep hearing that the terroir is nothin' special, but if that's true it's puzzling why the wines are always the best or at least among the best in the appellation.
 
originally posted by Keith Levenberg:
I'm a big fan of Graillot's Crozes and especially the Guiraude. I keep hearing that the terroir is nothin' special, but if that's true it's puzzling why the wines are always the best or at least among the best in the appellation.
Click to expand...

That's quite simple: with a few notable exceptions that have carried the rest of the appellation, Crozes really is a Syrah Côtes-du-Rhône (somewhat more potential for the whites, but they're rarely seen here). Alain does an amazing job given the vineyards that his wines come from. But there really is no terroir to express because, as Gertrude Stein said of Oakland (which is to San Francisco as Crozes-Hermitage is to Hermitage -- well, that's being unfair to parts of Oakland), "there is no there there." Crozes was lucky to keep itself tied to Saint-Joseph in the public eye, at least until quite recently, because there is so much more potential for better St-Jo sites (which is reflected these days in land prices; OTOH, there are plenty of poor St-Jo sites, too).
 
Hmmm...I think northern hillside Crozes is on par with the better St. J's...Rousset etc.

I do love the purity of Graillot, in terms of being a neutral expression of Syrah, but I don't think it hits the peaks that the better north Crozes can achieve.
 
There is no Crozes of my experience that remotely competes with, say, Gonon.

ETA: Lurkers tell me that it is confusing to introduce the St. Joseph comparison so abruptly. Apologies.
 
I puzzled why such an article might have appeared on a Saturday, but have noticed that the article and thread are a couple of years old.
 
But my question is more about the vintage in the Rhone. Both Croze and St Jo from Graillot have fantastic balance, which becomes especially evident from the complexity they develop when you leave them open for a couple of days. Balance is not the fist word that come to mind for most reds in France in 2009, even among regional groups where a number of my personal favourites come from. But I have not tasted many 09 northern rhones at all, thus the n00b question.
 
There are a lot of dark, ripe, rich reds in '09, north and south.

There are a lot of '10s from the north in my cellar or on the way there.
 
originally posted by BJ:
Hmmm...I think northern hillside Crozes is on par with the better St. J's...Rousset etc.
Click to expand...
There is very little hillside Crozes, and you've named most of them (not all of which I agree with in your saying that they can equal better St-Jo). That said, some can be on par with very good St-Jo, but generally not up to the best St-Jo that come from the likes of Gonon and Faurie -- it's a question of terroir first, and then, of course, producers who know how to get the best of those terroirs (because there are great St-Jo vineyards that are not producing great wines these days). As for the older Thalaberts, some of them were so amazing that I'm tempted to wonder if some Hermitage didn't actually wind up in them, although if that were the case, one would expect it to have been a rumor, and I've never heard it spoken.
 
originally posted by BJ:
originally posted by SFJoe:
remotely
Click to expand...

Rousset Picaudieres?
Sorrel blanc?
Jaboulet Roure?
Cuvee Louis Belle?
Old Thalabert (tho flatland)?
Dumaine Croix de Verre?
Click to expand...

What, you want actual data rather than wild-ass hand waving?

Some of those are within sight of Gonon, but I prefer none of them to him (and not to speak of small cuvees).

Rousset Picaudieres?

Good point. I've only tried it once, but it was quite good. Not Gonon, though. The guy's heart is in the right place.

Sorrel blanc?

I was thinking reds.

Jaboulet Roure?

Haven't had.

Cuvee Louis Belle?

Is OK.

Old Thalabert (tho flatland)?

It's been so long that I don't trust my memory.

Dumaine Croix de Verre?

Don't know it.
 
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