Produttori d B - Cru 2000's

Joel Stewart

Joel Stewart
Impulse buy, with a back story.

In NW Portland, there is a grocery store called City Market...if I remember correctly. I shop there on lunch breaks whenever in town working with a local master printer. Decent wine selection, cheese, meat, bread, etc. That's where I discovered PdB wines 10 or so yrs ago...and at the time, they were going for mid 20's. At the end of the day, I'd buy a bottle, some bread and a hunk of cheese, maybe a piece of roast chicken and head back to the hotel and gnosh while looking at the day's proofs pinned on the wall. Get up the next day and go to work, and pick up another bottle. I got a sense of the wines within a week and liked them a lot. Last year I came across a 6 cru set of 2000's in a wooden box here in Japan. I bit.

If you look at the technical sheets on the website, you'll see the elevage is the same for all the crus, which makes it easy to consider simply the exposure and terroirs involved. But in fact, it also appears the soils are mainly the same, exposure nearly the same as well...just the physical land and grapes themselves are what sit there, somehow being different, on each parcel, with a cru name attached. Despite such even seeming controls, the bottles we've had show easily detectable differences, making one ponder just what accounts for that, both in obvious and less so factors.

I know little about Barbaresco in general, though I have enjoyed nebbiolos along the way...just haven't geeked on them. I also lack knowledge regarding 2000 in Barbaresco, but judging from the wines, it seems it was a warm year, as the wines we've had so far (4) all show ripeness in varying degrees. We still have 2 more bottles to go. All of them, excepting Moccagatta, seem on the cusp of shifting from primary to secondary, but easily more the former than latter. 15 yrs would not seem outlandish to expect further development in a good way...maybe conservative. 20 for the right bottle....such as Rio Sordo...but I suspect these are comments for neb freaks, the rest could easily enjoy these wines now.

Round 1 (Tasted a month ago)

2000 Ovello - Off to a good start eh? Do not open a previously untasted wine while already intoxicated. Palate must have been extrememly skewed, but twist my arm, we opened this anyway. This was so bad I left it around for 3 days. It finally turned around, but still not very attractive. Saccharine sweetness overrode all else. Baked fruit notes...so I worried that my shallow passive cellar in this unusually hot summer killed the wine. Tannins still young, decent acidity, watery middle, some thin cherry, smoke and that unattractive sweetness. Not a great first bottle out of my 6 btl. cru set. So, out of both fear, intrigue and what-the-fuckedness, a week later I popped the Moccagatta...

2000 Moccagatta. No decanting, cellar chilled, zero air time in glass this is unbelievably balanced. Depth in the right places, just the right retention of fruit as if it was a memory of the original fruit, slightly dried pomegranate, some compote, spice and superb mouthfeel. Might go longer, but why wait. A shame without food, but easily marveled at alone. This is Barbaresco the way I like it. With air, tannins grow, but there is nothing really nothing to - (Dylan line?). Salty citric-ness of a small ripened tomato left for a day on a sunny windowsill. Perfect.

Round 2 (Last night)

2000 Paje - This started out like a nebbiolo that's been spiked with sweetness. Similar to the Ovello experience, but less pronounced thankfully. For the first hour the Rio Sordo was (much like the Moccogatta) showing restraint, balance if even yet underdeveloped. As time passed though, the Paje's excess sweetness (I wouldn't call it fruit, it seems to be just that - sweetness) diminished, while a rich jacket of acidity, meaty tones, iron etc. expanded around the core. By the night's end, this was my wine of the night. Flavors all in balance, reminding one of food-like depths. Not rich, but not light and full of nuance. Hard to say whether waiting much longer is worth it. Buy, decant, eat food with it.

2000 Rio Sordo - At first sip, this was the winner of the 2 last night, or so I thought. Classic, still young PdB neb. Sturdy frame of acidity, dusty, peppery tannins on the back end, mouthful is (like all of the wines) light, austere, slightly velvety. Flavors of smoky, dried cherry with a bit of savory beef drizzled with small ripe tomatos. This pretty much held it's position all night long, though both wines seemed to merge toward each other as the night went on....meaning here that the upright structure remained and a hint of Paje's fruit emerged towards the end.

Overall, I enjoyed these 4 and a nice diversion from all the vin naturels we've been consuming. These are wines from another approach, and have merits on their own...though a living brightness one finds in vin naturels is not found here, nor expected. I think overall these bottles, with the exception of the Moccagatta, still have a ways to go, but easily drinkable now.
 
Would have waited a few more years before opening these (though your experiment doesn't make a huge case for that), so you might want to wait on the remaining two, especially if one of them is the Rabaj.

As for similarities, all their vineyards face south or southwest. The 54 member families are required to sell 100% of their production to the coop, and payment is based on a formula that takes into account the sugar, color and acidity levels of a crushed sample. The musts are innoculated, and elevage is basically the same for all the crus.
 
Pora and Montestefano are the last 2..whaddya think? After last night, I did think maybe holding one bottle till 15 or so might be worth it.

It is interesting how the wines vary, given their raisin'.
 
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
I would definitely wait another five on the Montestefano. Some useful info straight from the horse's mouth here.

the '95 Montestefano (at Oliveto in Oakland in July) was just entering what seemed like early maturity; still showing plenty of primary fruit, but the carapace of tannin was distinctly receding; after about 30 minutes in decanter, it was beautiful. I'd be very confident that it has at least 5+ years of positive development ahead of it. Can't say for sure what means for your 2000, Joel, but if you have the patience, my bet is that your patience to 2015 would be rewarded.
 
originally posted by Joel Stewart:
Pora and Montestefano are the last 2..whaddya think? After last night, I did think maybe holding one bottle till 15 or so might be worth it.

It is interesting how the wines vary, given their raisin'.
I was lucky enough to have been poured a glass of 1967 Pora a couple weeks ago. I couldn't believe how amazingly fresh and alive it still was. Didn't seem anywhere near over-the-hill or fading. Fruit, tannins, balance; it was all there. Of course it seemed aged, but it was a very classy, graceful sort of aging. Even more surprising was that my glass was from a bottle that had been open for a day. It was a great match for what was probably the best beef tartare I had ever had. Very subtle flavors that intermingled with and didn't overwhelm the wine.

On the other hand. There was a bottle of 1970 Rabaja(?) that we had back in April that hadn't aged as nicely. What's the saying? There's no great wine only great bottles. Or something like that.
 
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
I would definitely wait another five on the Montestefano. Some useful info straight from the horse's mouth here.

Good call, I'll put that one away. Isn't their website great? But why oh why do the wines taste so obviously different?
 
originally posted by lars makie:
Might be.
originally posted by Joel Stewart:
Pora and Montestefano are the last 2..whaddya think? After last night, I did think maybe holding one bottle till 15 or so might be worth it.

It is interesting how the wines vary, given their raisin'.
I was lucky enough to have been poured a glass of 1967 Pora a couple weeks ago. I couldn't believe how amazingly fresh and alive it still was. Didn't seem anywhere near over-the-hill or fading. Fruit, tannins, balance; it was all there. Of course it seemed aged, but it was a very classy, graceful sort of aging. Even more surprising was that my glass was from a bottle that had been open for a day. It was a great match for what was probably the best beef tartare I had ever had. Very subtle flavors that intermingled with and didn't overwhelm the wine.

On the other hand. There was a bottle of 1970 Rabaja(?) that we had back in April that hadn't aged as nicely. What's the saying? There's no great wine only great bottles. Or something like that.

Was that with me, Jay Miller, et cetera? That bottle was toast.
 
If some of the elevage takes place in old wood, the details of the different wood vats (e.g., pore size, construction) could account for some of the differences, no? Especially if the same vats are assigned to particular crus year after year.

Nice post, thanks.
 
The sites are not "the same." They have similarities, yes. But it doesn't take much, as you can taste.
 
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by lars makie:
Might be.
originally posted by Joel Stewart:
Pora and Montestefano are the last 2..whaddya think? After last night, I did think maybe holding one bottle till 15 or so might be worth it.

It is interesting how the wines vary, given their raisin'.
I was lucky enough to have been poured a glass of 1967 Pora a couple weeks ago. I couldn't believe how amazingly fresh and alive it still was. Didn't seem anywhere near over-the-hill or fading. Fruit, tannins, balance; it was all there. Of course it seemed aged, but it was a very classy, graceful sort of aging. Even more surprising was that my glass was from a bottle that had been open for a day. It was a great match for what was probably the best beef tartare I had ever had. Very subtle flavors that intermingled with and didn't overwhelm the wine.

On the other hand. There was a bottle of 1970 Rabaja(?) that we had back in April that hadn't aged as nicely. What's the saying? There's no great wine only great bottles. Or something like that.

Was that with me, Jay Miller, et cetera? That bottle was toast.
Yep, that was the one. And toast it was.
 
Joel doesn't write that they are the same, he says 'mainly' and 'nearly' so.
Yes, I know. My point is that it's the wiggle room there that makes all the (very clear) difference.

If they really were "the same," knowing the levage is (here's the wiggle: more or less) the same, then we could start pointing to specific growers, or vine age, or whatever else. But the simpler explanation is that they're defined sites for a reason...not a qualitative one, necessarily, but a differential one.
 
If you must drink another, drink the Pora. Hold the Montestefano.

As to exposure... I thought they were all a bit different. Let me look for a map.
 
It won't tell you all you need to know, of course. What about that breeze that filters into the valley on this side of the hilltop town, but not that side? What about the slight depression 2/3 of the way up the hill? And so forth. Those won't appear on any map. (I know you know all this.)

Really, it (the Produttori lineup) as fine a demonstration of terroir vs. controlled variables as one is going to get in the real winemaking world. (There could be a better lab experiment, but it wouldn't have much to do with actual commercial winemaking.)
 
originally posted by Thor:
Joel doesn't write that they are the same, he says 'mainly' and 'nearly' so.
Yes, I know. My point is that it's the wiggle room there that makes all the (very clear) difference.

If they really were "the same," knowing the levage is (here's the wiggle: more or less) the same, then we could start pointing to specific growers, or vine age, or whatever else. But the simpler explanation is that they're defined sites for a reason...not a qualitative one, necessarily, but a differential one.
.

Right; I thought Joel was making the same point, essentially, by implication.
 
originally posted by Thor:
Joel doesn't write that they are the same, he says 'mainly' and 'nearly' so.
Yes, I know. My point is that it's the wiggle room there that makes all the (very clear) difference.

If they really were "the same," knowing the levage is (here's the wiggle: more or less) the same, then we could start pointing to specific growers, or vine age, or whatever else. But the simpler explanation is that they're defined sites for a reason...not a qualitative one, necessarily, but a differential one.

Anyone know if the vineyard names are named after people, or if they are expressions related to the place, like "Rio Sordo" sounds?
 
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