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originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
2008 Les Vergelesses

Bright, bright acidity. Clear as a bell. Tasty.
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I forced my way through most of a bottle of this wine a week ago and it was among the stemmiest wines I've drunk. Given the track record, I expect it will integrate, but for now this wine is YMMV. I poured out the last fifth of the bottle.
 
i drank an 08 les vergelesses last week that was (obviously) way too young, but not stemmy. really nice fruit and hints of complexity but tight.
 
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
All in one evening or over a couple of days?
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Two days. The domaine uses a lot of stem inclusion, as you probably know. I don't mean to say the stems tasted underripe -- they were just VERY up front in my bottle.
 
Still learning about the domaine, but I get the idea they make wines to drink down the road. In a year like 08, you'd expect the initial leanness to be especially prominent, I'd suppose. But it's all conjecture from my side. Thanks for your data.
 
In my limited experience, a poor young showing of Briailles with excessively stemmy aromatics is fairly normal and not a concern at all, at least with the Cortons.

Most recently, the '08 Corton-Bressandes was fairly repulsive aromatically. The underlying material on the palate was all stony, pure, grippy goodness.

I've personally not experienced this to the same degree with the Pernand-Vergelesses 1er crus but I would likely assume the same attitude there.
 
originally posted by slaton:
In my limited experience, a poor young showing of Briailles with excessively stemmy aromatics is fairly normal and not a concern at all, at least with the Cortons.

Most recently, the '08 Corton-Bressandes was fairly repulsive aromatically. The underlying material on the palate was all stony, pure, grippy goodness.

I've personally not experienced this to the same degree with the Pernand-Vergelesses 1er crus but I would likely assume the same attitude there.
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Agree, Slaton. I didn't mean to comment on the long-term quality of the wine. Just wanted to say that my bottle wasn't fun to drink right now.
 
I've never had many great bottles of chandon, 08's or older vintages. On the other hand, had a great bottle of rollin lower end cuvee (savigny les beaune or haute cotes de beaune, can't remember at the moment) that was showing great just a couple weeks ago. Showed so well that we wouldn't drink the 4 half full bottles of super stemy drc stuff (rsv, echezeaux, grands echezeaux, la tache) in front us to go back to the rollin. Not sure how the pernand or ile is doing right now, but i usually enjoy those a great deal as well.
 
originally posted by Guilhaume gerard:
I've never had many great bottles of chandon, 08's or older vintages. On the other hand, had a great bottle of rollin lower end cuvee (savigny les beaune or haute cotes de beaune, can't remember at the moment) that was showing great just a couple weeks ago. Showed so well that we wouldn't drink the 4 half full bottles of super stemy drc stuff (rsv, echezeaux, grands echezeaux, la tache) in front us to go back to the rollin. Not sure how the pernand or ile is doing right now, but i usually enjoy those a great deal as well.
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i greatly prefer rollin to chandon. it's not that i dislike chandon, just that i feel that every bottle i've had has been too young, even with some years on the bottle...
 
originally posted by Guilhaume gerard:
I've never had many great bottles of chandon, 08's or older vintages.
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I can't begin to count the ones I've had.
 
originally posted by scottreiner:
originally posted by Guilhaume gerard:
I've never had many great bottles of chandon, 08's or older vintages. On the other hand, had a great bottle of rollin lower end cuvee (savigny les beaune or haute cotes de beaune, can't remember at the moment) that was showing great just a couple weeks ago. Showed so well that we wouldn't drink the 4 half full bottles of super stemy drc stuff (rsv, echezeaux, grands echezeaux, la tache) in front us to go back to the rollin. Not sure how the pernand or ile is doing right now, but i usually enjoy those a great deal as well.
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i greatly prefer rollin to chandon. it's not that i dislike chandon, just that i've never had a bottle that i thought was not too young.
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+1
 
originally posted by Guilhaume gerard:
originally posted by scottreiner:
originally posted by Guilhaume gerard:
I've never had many great bottles of chandon, 08's or older vintages. On the other hand, had a great bottle of rollin lower end cuvee (savigny les beaune or haute cotes de beaune, can't remember at the moment) that was showing great just a couple weeks ago. Showed so well that we wouldn't drink the 4 half full bottles of super stemy drc stuff (rsv, echezeaux, grands echezeaux, la tache) in front us to go back to the rollin. Not sure how the pernand or ile is doing right now, but i usually enjoy those a great deal as well.
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i greatly prefer rollin to chandon. it's not that i dislike chandon, just that i've never had a bottle that i thought was not too young.
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+1
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I'll have to try more Rollin. My limited exposure gave me the sense of wines that were 'simpler' or more 'straight-forward' than CdB, and I preferred to focus my time on CdB. Although maybe my negative evaluation is exactly what you folks like about Rollin, given your comment about CdB being too young. So different preferences and all.

Either way, it's been a few years since I've had a Rollin so time is due.
 
originally posted by Rahsaan:
originally posted by Guilhaume gerard:
originally posted by scottreiner:
originally posted by Guilhaume gerard:
I've never had many great bottles of chandon, 08's or older vintages. On the other hand, had a great bottle of rollin lower end cuvee (savigny les beaune or haute cotes de beaune, can't remember at the moment) that was showing great just a couple weeks ago. Showed so well that we wouldn't drink the 4 half full bottles of super stemy drc stuff (rsv, echezeaux, grands echezeaux, la tache) in front us to go back to the rollin. Not sure how the pernand or ile is doing right now, but i usually enjoy those a great deal as well.
Click to expand...

i greatly prefer rollin to chandon. it's not that i dislike chandon, just that i've never had a bottle that i thought was not too young.
Click to expand...

+1
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I'll have to try more Rollin. My limited exposure gave me the sense of wines that were 'simpler' or more 'straight-forward' than CdB, and I preferred to focus my time on CdB. Although maybe my negative evaluation is exactly what you folks like about Rollin, given your comment about CdB being too young. So different preferences and all.

Either way, it's been a few years since I've had a Rollin so time is due.
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try the 08 haute cotes de beaune rouge. just beautiful right now -- delicate red fruit, sexy and feminine -- and available for @ $20.
 
Unlike CdB, I've had very limited exposure to Rollin, but this is clearly a producer worth following. More recently I have the unoaked Jay Miller to thank for a few pulls, although the 98 idv, the remaining 1/4 bottle of which I took the liberty of bringing home with me, stayed resistant to any forms of WMDs I tried to apply to it for a couple of days to get it to wake up.
My best experience to date is 02 village pernand, of all things. Puts many grand 02s to shame with its minerally happiness. Drained the bottle on my own in one sitting.
 
originally posted by scottreiner:

it's not that i dislike chandon, just that i feel that every bottle i've had has been too young, even with some years on the bottle...
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...and then they are too old.

rollin's ile hasn't missed very many vintages in as long as i can remember. the 82, 87 and 92 were some of the prettiest, longer lived wines of some otherwise not so reliable vintages.

pricewise, admirers of rollin have benefitted from fact the guys who tell you that the shit in your glass will be be worth 97 POINTS!!! if only you keep it until after you forget why you bought that shit in the first place have tended to despise the wines.

then again, i'm told they love c-d-b. i'm sure you will too.

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Agree that the 2008 Chandon de Briailles Bressandes was herbal and stemy...also a poor showing for me...but the lie des vergelesses Blanc made up for it...
 
coates' line on rollin has changed a lot over the years. given that the wines have hardly changed at all, it leaves one with the task of figuring out whether he was wrong then or now, and why one would care either way.

answering this riddle is far less fun than munching popcorn and watching wine waiters make tits of themselves on teh interbwebs, so i'll leave it to you to decide.

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