report of Clos St. Hune premox

hi Ignacio,

My impression of the 97 has been that it's a fairly advanced wine, by design, to a point where you are likely to encounter the type of normal bottle variation you'd see with a much older wine. Within these boundaries, there is no question I've observed bottle variation, but, again, consistent with how this vintages seems to have naturally evolved, perhaps with some additional consideration of how the bottles had been stored.

The 99, however, is surprising; this wine seems undeveloped, if anything.

Cheers!
 
originally posted by Ignacio Villalgordo:
In the case of CSH, they were to be found for a song here in spain not so long ago, so i have purchased and drunk quite a few

I have to wonder about the provenance if they were found for a song.
 
originally posted by David M. Bueker:
originally posted by Ignacio Villalgordo:
In the case of CSH, they were to be found for a song here in spain not so long ago, so i have purchased and drunk quite a few

I have to wonder about the provenance if they were found for a song.
Maybe he sings better than we do.
 
Maybe. CSH could be found in Can Roca (a 2* michelin) for around 50 and shop prices sold for just over that amount of money (we are talking when the exchange rate dolar / euro was the other way round)

As i said before, provenance or storage is not the main culprit, at least in my view
 
originally posted by Ignacio Villalgordo:
Maybe. CSH could be found in Can Roca (a 2* michelin) for around 50 and shop prices sold for just over that amount of money (we are talking when the exchange rate dolar / euro was the other way round)

As i said before, provenance or storage is not the main culprit, at least in my view

I believe that is over 20% less than the wines were selling for at the domaine on release. Of course, I don't understand the spanish distribution model - heck, I don't even understand the US - but I'm not sure how that would happen.

I'm not doubting that it did, just wondering why.

Edited: I do understand one part of the US distribution model: corpwines. I find them hysterically funny and a joy to deal with on many levels. Seriously.
 
I'm not a New Yorker. But thanks for joining us, Ignacio. As for the inside jokes, I thought the FAQ made this clear: we don't understand them either! Nevertheless, this doesn't stop us from participating in them.

I have to say that I concur with Mike and David: 50 is much, much cheaper than they're sold ex-cellar, and to have them at that price at Can Roca (one of my favorite restaurant meals ever, by the way) is as astounding as it is a matter of puzzlement.

And I also agree with .sasha that '97s were never meant for the long haul anyway, so to see them exhibiting increasing variation would make sense. I think I might differ with some in that I think the '99 was never destined for the long haul either, though for somewhat different reasons. I agree that that ones I've tasted have seemed underdeveloped, but my feeling is that they're going to turn a corner much more rapidly than is the norm for Clos Ste-Hune. I guess we'll see.

Alas, they're certainly not available for "a song" over here -- rather the opposite -- so opening one early for the cause of science is a more painful proposition than it would be at 50.
 
originally posted by Ignacio Villalgordo:
Well, being the cause of the discussion, i might just step in

... Reason is simple: i find more similarities between my palate here than elsewere, but is hard to get through the insider's jokes

... besides some old ones purchased in systembolaget which were trully amazing

...But what has someone from the third world have to teach you knowledgable new yorkers? Nothing, I would say...

Adios

Hello Ignacio!

I'm probably the person in question who may have inadvertently cast aspersions in your direction concerning your ability to discern premox in wine. Rest assured that it wasn't a personal vendetta, but only arose having read far too many reports of "bad bottles" written by people who might not actually that a wine can evolve in mysterious ways and that what a drinker seeks in a bottle may not always live up to their expectations. I posted here before looking up your profile on the other place and there's not much there to indicate that you do know what you're talking about and I assumed that the elmundovino link was an indication that you enjoy and recommend the magazine to others, not that you participate in their tastings. I was also projecting from my experience, in that if I were to taste a bottle of CSH from just about any vintage, I could write a tasting note and pass judgment on that bottle but would be unable to weigh in on anything else because frankly, I haven't tasted enough of the stuff to be able to write a cogent statement as to whether or not CSH from that era is going to hell in a handbasket (which hasn't precluded others in the other place from making blanket statements in similar situations).

Perhaps counterintuitively, I too value the reports, notes and suppositions posted here, even those by the Knowledgeable New Yorkers (the group of which many posters are not) more highly than I do the posts on other wine boards. My palate aligns with theirs more often than it does with any other group. Sure, there's lots of wacky inside stuff going on but that keeps it more interesting. I mean, how much fun would an Almodvar or Bunuel film be if we understood everything that was really going on? There'd be no reason to watch it again or argue about "what he really meant".

And pardon my ignorance, but does systembolaget sell directly to people outside of Sweden? Is it an EU sort of thing, or do you have to have someone in Sweden buy the wine and ship it to you?

My apologies for any umbrage you may have taken from my point of view, but consider the overall context of the terroir in which the seed was planted. I hope someday to be able to have enough experience tasting CSH of many vintages so that I too can post with authority on the subject. In the meantime, I'm happy to share my experience with the wines that I do have lots of experience with, such as Australian Shiraz, California Semillon, and Malbec.

-Eden (a left coast liberal who knows a little about a lot of things, not a knowledgeable New Yorker who knows all about everything)
 
originally posted by David M. Bueker:

My folks live in Harrisonburg, VA (dubious state abbreviation for wine lovers). Anywhere near you?

We are in Culpeper, about 30 miles over the Ridge from Harrisonburg - per mapquest, about and hour and a half. Nicolas Mestre, who posts here, is in Charlottesville. Maybe we could do an outside-of-DC thing some time.
 
originally posted by Thor:
Ian, I'm obviously not the monkey (more like the Cold Miser), but at last taste it was painfully leave-me-alone-ish, but in the good, CFE-esque way. If that makes sense.

Thanks, Thor. You're more like a gorilla, in a good way, if that makes any sense.

Thanks for the '96 data point. I have a stash but haven't opened one in years. If memory serves, I haven't opened them because of an old note you and Theresa posted on WLDG quite some time ago (can that be?).
 
Well, thanks for thw kind words.

To the systembolaget question, it is easy. You just have to visit the country. Besides, there are a couple of spaniards that come for xmas, and they can always bring a bottle or two

I also value the notes here. That's why i lurk here

Thanks
 
originally posted by Ignacio Villalgordo:

But what has someone from the third world have to teach you knowledgable new yorkers? Nothing, I would say...
Actually, if you could get to work on Brad, we'd all thank you.
 
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:

We are in Culpeper, about 30 miles over the Ridge from Harrisonburg - per mapquest, about and hour and a half. Nicolas Mestre, who posts here, is in Charlottesville. Maybe we could do an outside-of-DC thing some time.

I know it well. My wife went to grad school at UVA.
 
originally posted by Eden Mylunsch:

-Eden (a left coast liberal who knows a little about a lot of things, not a knowledgeable New Yorker who knows all about everything)

Well, just move to Manhattan and you too will know everything about everything. Losing my omniscience was one of the big downsides to moving away.
 
originally posted by Chris Coad:
originally posted by Levi Dalton:
originally posted by Brad Kane:
originally posted by Chris Coad:
Personally, I haven't had a '96-2000 FE in a number of years but was concerned by what Brad and John had reported.

Brad?

BRAD?

Really?

I guess you missed him dumping a beautiful glassful of '82 CSH and declaring it "oxidized," all evidence of everyone else's senses to the contrary.

Let me rephrase. All y'all have a higher tolerance for flawed wine than I do. Sorry, that '82 CSH just wasn't good and it was only half a glass I dumped.

Wow. I say again, Wow.

You see? And people constantly accuse me of making shit like that up. I only wish I were that creative.

I'll never doubt you again. Promise.
 
originally posted by Levi Dalton:
originally posted by Chris Coad:
originally posted by Levi Dalton:
originally posted by Brad Kane:
originally posted by Chris Coad:
Personally, I haven't had a '96-2000 FE in a number of years but was concerned by what Brad and John had reported.

Brad?

BRAD?

Really?

I guess you missed him dumping a beautiful glassful of '82 CSH and declaring it "oxidized," all evidence of everyone else's senses to the contrary.

Let me rephrase. All y'all have a higher tolerance for flawed wine than I do. Sorry, that '82 CSH just wasn't good and it was only half a glass I dumped.

Wow. I say again, Wow.

You see? And people constantly accuse me of making shit like that up. I only wish I were that creative.

I'll never doubt you again. Promise.

...it starts to get fuzzy after a while.
 
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