Dinner with Abe Schoener

M

Matt Latuchie

Matt Latuchie
SCHOLIUM DINNER - Ripple - Cleveland Park, Washington, D.C. (8/4/2011)

After opening some Scholium Project wines with some friends, I posted my lukewarm notes to the Wine Berserker forum. Not long after I received an email from winemaker Abe Schoener asking if I'd be interested in hosting another dinner with him! Fast-forward a couple weeks, and I'm sitting next to Abe in DC tasting a large selection of his wines!

Big thanks to the staff at Ripple for great service, Tim O'Rourke for helping arrange the reservation, and, of course, thanks to Abe for flying in for this very fun evening!

Champagne Flight

1996 Ployez-Jacquemart Champagne Liesse d'Harbonville - France, Champagne

Just a hair below the bottle I had in December. The nose reminds me a boulangerie with baked bread, yeast, and cream. Still very energetic on the palate with crisp herbs, crushed rocks, meyer lemon and brioche.
1996 Pierre Péters Champagne Blanc de Blancs Brut Cuvée Spéciale - France, Champagne, Le Mesnil Sur Oger, Champagne

To me, this bottle contains everything I look for in Champagne; energy, finesse, depth, and polish. Still in its youth, this wine is electric with pure lemon juice poured over crushed rocks...just electric minerality and acidity. Should mature into a wine that can hang with the heavyweights from 1996.

Scholium White Flight 1

2009 Scholium Project Marcher Sûr la Lune Reserve Bokisch Ranches - USA, California, Central Valley, Lodi

Like the last time I had this, the nose has tones of bananas, herbs and fresh flowers. And again, like last time, the nose had a lot of heat. The palate is massive with dense floral tones, citrus, and subtle honeycomb. Finish was long a bit hot for me.
2009 Scholium Project Naucratis Lost Slough Vineyards - USA, California, Central Valley, Clarksburg

Interesting nose of banana peel, fresh herbs, and lemon salt. Alcohol creeps into the nose, and is noticeable on the palate. Fruit is very pure and rich. I'd like to let this rest with the hope that the heat will diminish with some age.

Scholium White Flight 2

2007 Scholium Project Choephoroi Los Olivos Vineyard - USA, California, Central Coast, Santa Ynez Valley

A nicely composed wine with great minerals and precision. Nose had a touch of heat, subtle honeycomb and fresh spring herbs. The palate is dense but doesn't have too much weight.
2009 Scholium Project Michael Faraday Matthiasson Family Vineyards - USA, California, Sonoma County

From a barrel sample. Incredibly weighty chardonnay. Nose has an interesting waxiness to it with lots of lemon, herbs, and honey. The palate is rich and smooth with considerable weight. The alcohol was a bit aggressive for me, but I imagine time will help turn this aspect down a bit.

Scholium Red Flight 1

2005 Scholium Project Satrapies of the East - USA, California

While drinking this with Abe, he spent a good deal of time describing this wines story and the role that winemaking had in the final product. I'm happy he did, because when I first smelled the nose I was sure that it was heat damaged. Abe said that reduction was a natural part of this wine, and not a flaw. Good to know. The nose had stewed warm dark fruits; plums, blackberries, and blueberries. There was also a warm charcoal note too. The palate was far more to my liking with spicy red and dark fruits with a nice floral component. Very nice acidity on the finish too.
2005 Scholium Project Babylon Tenbrink Vineyards - USA, California

Another one of Abe's red's with what I perceive to be reduction on the nose. A beast of a wine with dense purple and black fruit with hearty tannin. The finish has some acidity (as is the case with most of Abe's wines), which is a must with a wine this big and hefty.

Scholium Red Flight 2

2007 Scholium Project Bricco Babelico Tenbrink Vineyards - USA, California

Dense black fruit on the nose with an obvious mint component that seemed to be more fitting of a cabernet. The palate has lots of blueberry, blackberry jam, and warm spices. Alcohol spiked a bit on the palate for me - should be a bit hit with california petite sirah lovers.
2009 Scholium Project Chuey - USA, California, North Coast

From barrel sample. Had very nice dark fruit and subtle mint on the nose with undertones of smoke and lavender. Has nice weight, but also good deal of elegance. Enjoyed this stylish cabernet very much.

Champagne Interlude

2004 Vilmart & Cie Champagne Grand Cellier d'Or 1er Cru - France, Champagne

Compared to a couple 1996 champagnes that were opened before this, it was clear that this bottle was a youngster! Far more taut on the palate, this had vibrant lemon tones with delicate brioche and yeast tones. I thought that this would benefit from another 5 years or so.

Grab Bag Flight

2005 Ferrando Nebbiolo di Carema Black Label (Etichetta Nera) - Italy, Piedmont, Northern Piedmont, Nebbiolo di Carema

From beginning to end, this wine reminded me of roasting dark fruit over a campfire. A lot of times this would be a negative - but I found this one to be quite nice! The body of the wine was relatively lithe, yet packed a serious punch of dark fruit, earthen undertones with a smokey haze.
2004 Scholium Project Scythia Donati Vineyards - USA, California, Central Coast, San Benito County

Really glad this bottle made the trip with Abe to DC. Incredibly complex nose of smokey meats, black fruit and dusty red fruit. I caught an interesting saline component on the nose that reminded me of tidal pools - part sea water, part sea shell, part wet stone. Usually I associate these tones with Burgundian or Alsatian wines, so it was awesome seeing it here too! The palate was rocky and bloody with layers of dark fruit, and soil. Awesome stuff.
2004 Domaine Gauby Côtes du Roussillon Villages La Muntada - France, Languedoc Roussillon, Roussillon, Côtes du Roussillon Villages

Bold and fruited with smokey minerals on the nose. The palate was driven by blackberry compote, charcoal, and roasted herbs. Thought the acidity was nice on the finish, too.
2009 Marco Felluga Collio Sauvignon Blanc Russiz Superiore - Italy, Friuli-Venezia Giulia, Collio

Incredibly fresh on the palate with lots of acid, grass, and grapefruit. This had some noticeable weight too with really nice herbal tones throughout.

Desert

2005 Bert Simon Serriger Herrenberg Riesling Auslese Goldkapsel - Germany, Mosel Saar Ruwer

A great showing by this bottle. Really electric nose with minerals, florals, and tangerine (Tim did a great job pulling that flavor out). Palate was focused and precise. Great white florals, nice tropical fruit with nice weight. Feels more like a Spatlese.
2005 Domaine des Baumard Coteaux du Layon Clos de Sainte Catherine - France, Loire Valley, Anjou-Saumur, Coteaux du Layon

A bit denser than the bottle i opened a couple weeks ago. Had the trademark apricot and white flower nose. Palate had dense fruit with a little less than usual acidity. Very nice wine, but not as focused as before.
2003 Domaine Jo Pithon Coteaux du Layon Saint-Lambert Les Bonnes Blanches - France, Loire Valley, Anjou-Saumur, Coteaux du Layon Saint-Lambert

Dark amber color with dense nutty and smokey tones - reminded me of scotch almost. The palate was fresher than the nose would suggest with a nice streak of minerals coarsing below the hazelnut, almond skin, and fire-roasted fruit tones.
2006 Albert Mann Riesling Altenbourg Vendanges Tardives - France, Alsace, Kientzheim & Sigolsheim, Alsace AOC

This had incredibly clarity and focus. The sweetness here was incredibly delicate and nuanced with lithe floral and citrus tones on an almost airy palate. Really enjoyed this.
 
Thanks for the notes Matt. Abe seems like a really interesting guy with a clear vision of the kind of wine he wants to make. I admire that.

Having said that, the wines aren't for me. I've enjoyed a few of the Prince in his Caves but others are just too big, too much alcohol, too much everything. And I can't find any food to go with them.

But seriously, the wine world is better off with people like Abe in it.
 
I'm jealous that you got to have the dinner with Abe. He seems like a lot of fun.

I haven't had very many of his wines and so may not have had a chance to have as clear a vision as you have of what he's up to.
 
Matt,
Abe is a gas and his wines are provocative.
Glad you had a chance to party with him.
He is still my reference point for skin fermented sauvignon with the Prince and, although my wines are different, I hope to have the success he has had with that style.
Best, Jim
 
Thanks for the notes. I am glad you got a chance to retaste the wines as I am sure the original tasting was marred because the wines were recently bottled and shipped. Abe's whites really need to settle and show much better with a decant.
 
Interesting notes. I've only had about 5 or 6 of the Scholium wines, but the one thing that has marred each and every experience has been heat. The wines show their alcohol. The Naucratis is the most egregious offender in that vein.
 
originally posted by David M. Bueker:
alcohol. The Naucratis is the most egregious offender in that vein.
Click to expand...
My one experience with this wine was friendlier than that. But clearly a wine to drink chilled.
 
I have never had any of these wines, but I am curious about the friendly, if not completely open-armed reception, they get here and, for instance, in Eric Asimov's article about them. I'm sure Abe Schoener is a wonderful human being and someone who makes the wine he wants to make, pursuing his own vision. But I've met numbers of people who make spoofy wines who are wonderful human beings who make the wines they want to make. And one regularly hears of people making superlative traditional wines who are haughty rotters. I'm happy to give Mr. Schoener all the praise there is for who he is and for his willingness to make the wines he wants to make. But why does that mean we have to be nicer to his wines than to others around here with high alcohol and tropical fruit flavors. Again, I've never had the wines. I'm just reading the tasting notes and asking.
 
Because it's nearly impossible to disentangle the person from the wine (or should that be the other way round)? It's like what one famous author said about not wanting to meet authors he reviewed.
 
Abe really is a blast to drink with...he started off our dinner with the following toast:

"i wanted to come to dc to drink with this group, because you are probably the first group that has had a tepid response to my wine - most people either love it or hate it. after reading the notes from your original tasting, i said to myself 'i need to taste with these guys!'"

i agree that the wine world is better off having guys like abe, despite the fact that his wines don't regularly hit my palate's sweet spot. i'm going to continue buying his mixed packs.
 
There is an interesting tension here, between the notion of terroir-transparency - the idea that the winemaker is in a certain sense self-effacing, someone whose skill involves getting out of nature's way and letting the land and grapes express themselves - and the notion of the winemaker as an expressive artist whose personal vision is shared through the wines she makes.
 
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
But why does that mean we have to be nicer to his wines than to others around here with high alcohol and tropical fruit flavors. Again, I've never had the wines. I'm just reading the tasting notes and asking.
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Leaving aside personalities (although I agree with Yixin), because they are different. Look at the love Corneilson gets and they are equally weird.
Something that doesn't taste like anything else is not only novel it stretches the imagination/palate.
As it so happens, Abe is also quite forthright and honest, even about his lapses in judgment and technique - all the more reason to at least try his stuff.
Best, jim
 
originally posted by Yixin:
Because it's nearly impossible to disentangle the person from the wine (or should that be the other way round)? It's like what one famous author said about not wanting to meet authors he reviewed.
Click to expand...

One wants people one likes to do well. And when someone is intellectually engaging as well as a decent human being, one wants to think that the intellectual engagement will have positive results. And no doubt I experience the same bias within limits. But as someone who has to evaluate the work of people you know, you know that it is possible to see that someone you like and respect somehow didn't achieve what he or she could have.

More to the point, it is more than possible to see someone one likes and respects putting efforts toward a goal one doesn't share, say, for instance producing a kind of art one didn't like (as opposed to producing a failed work of art). I was suggesting that lots of people who produce spoofy wine were doing this--one of whom, to judge from tasting notes, would be Abe Schoener. If we are going to be all fairthinking and openminded about him, we will soon have to change the entire tone of this board.
 
originally posted by Florida Jim:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
But why does that mean we have to be nicer to his wines than to others around here with high alcohol and tropical fruit flavors. Again, I've never had the wines. I'm just reading the tasting notes and asking.
Click to expand...

because they are different. Look at the love Corneilson gets and they are equally weird.
Something that doesn't taste like anything else is not only novel it stretches
Best, jim
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A good answer, but it may prove too much. Some of the garagiste bordeaux I tasted before I gave the stuff up were novel and different. Sine Qua Non is different enough to curl my hair.

I'd actually be happy going all Rawlsian and considering honestly spoofy wines as part of our liberal state, even if we--or I--just don't like them. But ire, irony and the pleasures of resentiment would all drain from the board.
 
originally posted by Steven Spielmann:
Neutrality about preferences has a place in politics and perhaps in morals; in aesthetics however one must leave it at the door.
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I would argue that the necessity of being indifferent to the existence of the object of our appreciation makes a certain kind of neutrality a logical consequence. One can no more not have the tastes one has, then one can not have the beliefs one has and that means one won't share them with the tastes of some others. But that doesn't entail dismissiveness of alternatives.
 
First of all let me concede that the majority of Abe's California wines are high alcohol. Spoofy and unbalanced they definitely are not. The mere mention of spoofiness in the context of his wines is a JOKE. Interestingly Abe's NY wines are all around 12-13%. There are many examples of unspoofulated wines that are high alcohol (e.g., Cornelison, Dettori and Gramemon).

Tension is an excellent word to use when discussing Abe's wines. I poured his wines for a few German Winemakers and Uli Stein said one word - TENSION.
 
"A certain kind of neutrality" - if you buy Kant, OK. But if you're going there you also get

"In all judgements by which we describe anything as beautiful, we tolerate no one else being of a different opinion, and in taking up this position we do not rest our judgement upon concepts, but only on our feeling. Accordingly we introduce this fundamental feeling not as a private feeling, but as a public sense," and,

"In all judgements by which we describe anything as beautiful, we tolerate no one else being of a different opinion, and in taking up this position we do not rest our judgement upon concepts, but only on our feeling. Accordingly we introduce this fundamental feeling not as a private feeling, but as a public sense. Now, for this purpose, experience cannot be made the ground of this common sense, for the latter is invoked to justify judgements containing an "ought".The assertion is not that every one will fall in with our judgement, but rather that every one ought to agree with it. Here I put forward my judgement of taste as an example of the judgement of common sense, and attribute to it on that account exemplary validity. Hence common sense is a mere ideal norm."

So that is a certain kind of non-neutrality, and more the sort of thing I had in mind.

Outside of Kant, the claim was more like this: in politics we are concerned with the organization of society and in morals we are concerned with action. Relative to those domains, we can be neutral about preferences (though we need not be - Aristotle certainly was not, for example). But there is a sense in which, in aesthetics, we can't be neutral about preferences, for the subject-matter of aesthetics is what experiential preferences we ought to have.

I'll now withdraw the claim, since I don't particularly know whether I believe it or not. Tough free associating with the profs on the board.
 
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
A good answer, but it may prove too much. Some of the garagiste bordeaux I tasted before I gave the stuff up were novel and different. Sine Qua Non is different enough to curl my hair.
Click to expand...

Novelty is one thing, preference another.
No fan of SQN am I, although I am happy to taste any that is opened for me.
Turns out, I like some of Abe's wines; hence the love - from me.
Best, Jm
 
originally posted by Florida Jim:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
A good answer, but it may prove too much. Some of the garagiste bordeaux I tasted before I gave the stuff up were novel and different. Sine Qua Non is different enough to curl my hair.
Click to expand...

Novelty is one thing, preference another.
Turns out, I like some of Abe's wines; hence the love - from me.
Best, Jm
Click to expand...

An entirely different claim and one that is jake with me, especially since I haven't tasted the wines to know whether I would disagree. Same response to Robert Dentice.

But then it turns out I am addressing all of those around here who react to high alcohol and outsized tropical fruit flavors and for them, the question still stands.

Passing on arguments about aesthetics, which we've had before, all I would claim is that any basis on which one would argue a preference for civil discourse with regard to beliefs that might cut very close to one's moral bone would surely argue for a civil discourse about aesthetic taste, which ought not cut that close.

Kant's psychological observations about how we hold our aesthetic tastes (as opposed to other tastes) are relevant here only to the extent that Kant felt the same way about how we hold our cognitive beliefs, but not about how we felt about our sensual preferences.
 
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