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Clos Rougeard
- Thread starter wrrntl
- Start date
originally posted by VLM:
I'll be in DC soon.
really? what's your story?
originally posted by maureen:
originally posted by VLM:
I'll be in DC soon.
really? what's your story?
Arraignment, most likely [insert emoticon of choice here]
Mark "Never seen him before in my life!" Lipton
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
originally posted by fatboy:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Why did you open these so young? I have one each of the three 2006s and didn't expect to touch them for another 10 years.
i give up.
fb.
Don't give up, teach. According to your porcine excellency's linear programming models, what would be the ideal horizontal optimization strategy?
Oliver McCrum
Oliver McCrum
originally posted by Yixin:
originally posted by VLM:
As for the Brett notes, that has never been a problem with Rougeard, IME. I will often conflate Brett and reduction, the latter being more likely with Rougeard.
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by Yixin:
VLM, I'll front the cost of testing for a bottle procured in France, with the over/under at 500micrograms/litre (4-ethyl-phenol). How about that?
You are on. What is that?
One of the products of brett activity. Wikipedia
Which bottle do you want to test? '97 Poyeux? Where do you want it tested? I only know ETS (in CA) and Merck (in Singapore).
Stake is cost of test (including bottle), and a mixed case of Clos Rougeard?
Judging by the '06 I had recently, over 500 is a good bet.
originally posted by maureen:
originally posted by VLM:
I'll be in DC soon.
really? what's your story?
Old friend had baby, need to come make its acquaintance. I'll send you word when I have an actual date.
originally posted by Ned Hoey:
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by wrrntl:
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by wrrntl:
originally posted by Brian C:
originally posted by wrrntl:
A funkier nose than the single vineyards and more greenness up front.
Is not the "clos" a single vineyard bottling? I thought, despite it's more vague name, that it was from a single regular block rather than a blend.
B
No source to cite? Never heard that or seen that on anyone's website or blog. LD website has it only listed as AOC and since it no longer even says "Clos" maybe it used to be? Sure someone here can "own" me on that, too. Curious if you know where you heard this or are you just hopping on the "shit on newbs bandwagon"?
Fuck you noob, I hope you kill yourself. Christ, don't be such a pussy.
The Clos is indeed a single vineyard, much like the Bourg though less well situated, owned by the Foucault brothers. The Poyeux is worked by more than one family and is not by the house.
My source is my own memory, which is good enough for a court of law, but falls short in the lab.
The most recent 2004 Bourg I had also showed well. In fact, I'm a believer that it shows well before the Poyeux due to more limestone in the Poyeux vineyard making for a more angular wine.
A recent 2005 Clos was pretty backwards, especially juxtaposed with the 2004, which is beautiful now and sure to be for a long time if the 1997 is any gauge (it has been drinking well for about a decade).
As for the Brett notes, that has never been a problem with Rougeard, IME. I will often conflate Brett and reduction, the latter being more likely with Rougeard.
Count me at the head of the vanguard of drinking these when they still have some of their vibrancy of youth left. These are beautiful, regal wines and I feel lucky every time I get to drink one.
Hey Old Man I don't trust your memory and neither do any sources on the internet. Pulled from the winedoctor, you know some other schnook whose "specialty" is the Loire Valley:
The leading cuvée of Saumur-Champigny is Le Bourg, which comes from a 1 hectare plot of 70-year-old Cabernet Franc vines planted on soils comprised of a thin layer of clay. These are the vines that lie directly behind the courtyard and its anonymous gateway. There is also Les Poyeux, from a more distant plot of 45-year-old vines on more sandy soils, and finally for the reds there is the domaine Saumur-Champigny which is produced from other plots.
Another blog post by someone who visited through their connection, Jules Dressner, "the Clos, 4.5 ha of assorted smaller plots of Cabernet Franc"
Brett is not only an indication of bottle variation but tends to evoke different responses in many individuals. I know I am sensitive to any brett and do not consider it a flaw in these wines. Reduction and brett tend to be an issue with "natural" wines that don't or minimally use SO2, right? So is it surprising if it arises in a bottling you describe as "backwards"?
Hmmm, not sure that I'd take Jules as my source. What did Dougherty think?
I'm pretty sure I took a leak in the vineyard behind their house that was Clos, not Bourg.
I'll be in DC soon. What days do you work?
Bourg is "a clos". Clos is not Bourg.
Bourg is behind the house. Poyeaux is outside of town. Clos is assorted small plots. C'est vrai.
I've definitely pissed in the Bourg before, but I thought the other vines around the house made the Clos.
Anyway, the Clos bottling has more in common with the Bourg than either do with the Poyeux.
originally posted by Oliver McCrum:
Judging by the '06 I had recently, over 500 is a good bet.
I think so too. Will VLM take the under, though?
U
Unknown
Guest
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
originally posted by fatboy:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Why did you open these so young? I have one each of the three 2006s and didn't expect to touch them for another 10 years.
i give up.
fb.
Don't give up, teach. According to your porcine excellency's linear programming models, what would be the ideal horizontal optimization strategy?
there probably isn't a right answer to questions about broad vs deep, or quantity versus quality (for all i know, this might even be a good thing - for art, anyway).
and i readily admit to being a far more monomaniacal drinker than most.
yet even though there maybe lots of perfectly lots of plausible ways of going about all this, keeping lots of single bottles for huge periods of time isn't one of them. forgive the even flabbier than usual metaphor, but doing so strikes me as being akin to a dude spending a decade in pursuit of his ideal mate, and then, when he finally gets to take her out on a date, making sure that its at a noisy bar so he can get blind drunk, bone and split before she wakes up and asks for his number...
if you are going to keep it around for 10 years, why not spend some time getting to know it? and if that means having to forgo other pleasures, well maybe that's the price you have to pay to make that relationship work.
something like that, anyway.
fb.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
Sigh, all these intermediate dates on the way to the altar are going to cost me, but then.
kirk wallace
kirk wallace
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Sigh, all these intermediate dates on the way to the altar are going to cost me, but then.
I love experiencing a relationship as it develops, and I totally don't believe in monogamy. Wine is similar. But easier.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
originally posted by kirk wallace:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Sigh, all these intermediate dates on the way to the altar are going to cost me, but then.
I love experiencing a relationship as it develops, and I totally don't believe in monogamy. Wine is similar. But easier.
And here I was, thinking wine made the joys of monogamy bearable (by diverting excess Eros into Bacchus).
U
Unknown
Guest
ach there's no need to take vows. it's just that there's something to be said for moving on beyond the gloryhole scene that dominates teh boredz.
fb.
fb.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
I am such a babe in the woods, I had to look up gloryhole in my Pocket Chomsky. I see it is a feature of orthodox mating rituals.
Jeff Grossman
Jeff Grossman
It's a feature of glass-blowing.
originally posted by SFJoe:
Bourg is the pissoir. Clos is a commute.
The Dougherty has spoken. It is so.
originally posted by fatboy:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
originally posted by fatboy:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Why did you open these so young? I have one each of the three 2006s and didn't expect to touch them for another 10 years.
i give up.
fb.
Don't give up, teach. According to your porcine excellency's linear programming models, what would be the ideal horizontal optimization strategy?
there probably isn't a right answer to questions about broad vs deep, or quantity versus quality (for all i know, this might even be a good thing - for art, anyway).
and i readily admit to being a far more monomaniacal drinker than most.
yet even though there maybe lots of perfectly lots of plausible ways of going about all this, keeping lots of single bottles for huge periods of time isn't one of them. forgive the even flabbier than usual metaphor, but doing so strikes me as being akin to a dude spending a decade in pursuit of his ideal mate, and then, when he finally gets to take her out on a date, making sure that its at a noisy bar so he can get blind drunk, bone and split before she wakes up and asks for his number...
if you are going to keep it around for 10 years, why not spend some time getting to know it? and if that means having to forgo other pleasures, well maybe that's the price you have to pay to make that relationship work.
something like that, anyway.
fb.
Now this is something I can understand and agree with.
I pretty much buy from about 8-10 domains these days, but I buy deeply at each.
To follow on the corpulent one's metaphor, as you grow wiser, you have a much better idea of what you are looking for, so while you may chase fleeting things while you are drinking from someone's cellar that isn't yours, you draw great comfort at what you have at home.
Jonathan Loesberg
Jonathan Loesberg
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by fatboy:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
originally posted by fatboy:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Why did you open these so young? I have one each of the three 2006s and didn't expect to touch them for another 10 years.
i give up.
fb.
Don't give up, teach. According to your porcine excellency's linear programming models, what would be the ideal horizontal optimization strategy?
there probably isn't a right answer to questions about broad vs deep, or quantity versus quality (for all i know, this might even be a good thing - for art, anyway).
and i readily admit to being a far more monomaniacal drinker than most.
yet even though there maybe lots of perfectly lots of plausible ways of going about all this, keeping lots of single bottles for huge periods of time isn't one of them. forgive the even flabbier than usual metaphor, but doing so strikes me as being akin to a dude spending a decade in pursuit of his ideal mate, and then, when he finally gets to take her out on a date, making sure that its at a noisy bar so he can get blind drunk, bone and split before she wakes up and asks for his number...
if you are going to keep it around for 10 years, why not spend some time getting to know it? and if that means having to forgo other pleasures, well maybe that's the price you have to pay to make that relationship work.
something like that, anyway.
fb.
Now this is something I can understand and agree with.
I pretty much buy from about 8-10 domains these days, but I buy deeply at each.
To follow on the corpulent one's metaphor, as you grow wiser, you have a much better idea of what you are looking for, so while you may chase fleeting things while you are drinking from someone's cellar that isn't yours, you draw great comfort at what you have at home.
I think this is a taste thing and not a wisdom thing. I remember a discussion with Robert Callahan in which I said I buy multiple bottles of fewer wines so that I can follow what they do and become. And he said, with some surprise, "Don't you like to drink different things?" I can imagine being a flitter all one's life, even though I'm not.
Age also allows one to diversify selectively. This has been true for me academically as well as in wine. Time means one doesn't have to leave one's fields of specialty to do some different things as well just because they interest you. I don't know if that's wisdom or evolved flittery. But it works in the way it works.
VLM, you haven't answered my questions about the wager.
The solution is to drink often, and with friends. My business partner and I had a ripe 2009 Cab Franc-Cab Sauv blend from the Anjou which was good, but showed the effects of 100% destemming even in ripe years, and a sparkling Grolleau Gris tonight. Without the extra body I doubt I would have gotten past the very nice 2010 Sauv Blanc from the Touraine.
The solution is to drink often, and with friends. My business partner and I had a ripe 2009 Cab Franc-Cab Sauv blend from the Anjou which was good, but showed the effects of 100% destemming even in ripe years, and a sparkling Grolleau Gris tonight. Without the extra body I doubt I would have gotten past the very nice 2010 Sauv Blanc from the Touraine.