NWR: coffee, roasting and terroir

originally posted by Chris Tuttle:
Anyone else besides me like Nespresso shots? *duck*

I'm so sick of sbux & local shops giving me a small cup of burnt coffee/wood & water and calling it espresso. The nespresso usually makes a nice crema, too.

I have one in my office as well, since nothing else would fit in and I have no sink. The somewhat sad truth is that if you select the right varieties it tastes better than 98% of what you get for espresso in the local coffee shops. And they are better than any of the other pod systems by a mile.
 
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
My upstairs neighbor has Nespresso. I've tried a bunch of the flavors. It's about the same as the K-Cup, really.

I'm pretty sure the Keurig machines just run hot water (sans high pressure) through the K-cup (which contains a filter). The Nespresso pumps water through the pod at 19 bars. Anyway, it's easy-peasy-lemon-squeezy espresso and that's good enough for now.
 
I drink a lot of Keurig (it's what we have at work) but have never tried Nespresso so I can't compare. I can say that the Keurig makes adequate coffee which puts it miles ahead of the Flavia it replaced.
 
We have a Keurig at home. It's fine for the work week when we're rushing around getting ready in the morning.

Drip coffee or French press on Sat and Sun.
 
originally posted by georg lauer:
originally posted by Chris Tuttle:
Anyone else besides me like Nespresso shots? *duck*

I'm so sick of sbux & local shops giving me a small cup of burnt coffee/wood & water and calling it espresso. The nespresso usually makes a nice crema, too.

I have one in my office as well, since nothing else would fit in and I have no sink. The somewhat sad truth is that if you select the right varieties it tastes better than 98% of what you get for espresso in the local coffee shops. And they are better than any of the other pod systems by a mile.

Good espresso is near to impossible to get in restaurants, and nearly as difficult to get at home, as Maureen alas found. Part of the problem is equipment-based (it's not easy to safely shoot steam through coffee grounds at high pressure) but part of the problem is user error: too many people don't know when to stop extracting the grounds and end up with overly bitter espresso. My best espresso experiences have been in Italy (duh!) and Spain in true caf(f)és, but second best have been when backpacking where I take a pint-sized version of the old-school aluminum stove-top espresso maker and some pre-ground -- yes -- Peet's Italian Roast.

Mark Lipton
 
I always placed Moka Pot coffee somewhere between drip and espresso - as in I'd drink it, but not if I had a choice. I don't think it really qualifies as espresso, the pressure can't be close. It's also really hard to get a good crema which is the part of espresso (imho) that makes all the spoof additives unnecessary.
 
originally posted by mlawton:
I always placed Moka Pot coffee somewhere between drip and espresso - as in I'd drink it, but not if I had a choice. I don't think it really qualifies as espresso, the pressure can't be close. It's also really hard to get a good crema which is the part of espresso (imho) that makes all the spoof additives unnecessary.

No disagreement, Mike, but in my case it's the lack of user error in making the cup that promotes it.

Mark Lipton
 
Yo-

Arjun- If you mean that Kenyan coffees and Burgundian wines are both too expensive, then yes.

One thing to understand is that there is much more to coffee roasting than simply light and dark. There are 120 (ish) different reactions that happen in the first 8 minutes. They happen at different times or some may or may not occur depending on the roast. We generally think of coffee roasting in terms of light and dark, when the roast style, or journey from green to brown, is also important.

But back to light and dark for simplicitys sake-- Acidity for me is a lot of what gives flavor and differentiability to each coffee. As a coffee gets roasted darker many of the compounds and shit begin to break down and carbon is introduced. This can 'homogenize' the flavor to just "coffee flavor". When people say they like "chocolately" coffee I feel like they don't like coffee, just as a buttery chardonnay drinker just doesn't like chardonnay. At this point you are tasting the process more than the coffee itself, such as drinking a wine of an irrigated vineyard that is chaptalized and inoculated and pumped with shit tons of sulphur and oak etc.

Additionally coffee that is roasted quite light and pulled far before any carbon introduction lacks development in many ways and tastes bright, green, astringent etc. Light roasted coffee is definitely what I consider the coffee I drink to be, but so much of it can be crap. I like natural wines, but so many natural wines can be natural just for naturals sake and taste not so good.

As far as how coffee fits into the whole wine thread thing: I've been lucky enough to serve light roasted coffee to people who like dark roasted coffee and to serve light, fresh honest wines to people who like super extracted lab experiments. I've been lucky enough to serve the same people actually, and its been quite a fun thing to observe. There is generally a group of people who don't necessarily know much (not in a bad way) and ask in the morning for the darkest coffee and in the evening for the boldest wine. These people seem to hate acidity and often times you have to tell them to shut their eyes and their mouth (nicely) and give them something that they shouldn't think of as wine/coffee, and they tend to like it.
Then there is a group of people who know quite a bit and immediately start naming off what parts of costa rica they have been to and how they are still so jet lagged from flying back in from provence last week. Generally you have the same approach, shut up (nicely) drink this, enjoy.
Then there are people who don't know a damn thing (which i dont either) and just want something enjoyable and want to trust someone to give them something enjoyable. They shell out the same $12 for a glass of wine or $3.50 for a cup of coffee and love it or hate it blindly. Those are some of my favorites.

Anywho I've been talking to three different people and writing this at the same time so I apologize for any nonsensical aspects. Here's to honest wine, good coffee, and cheap mexican beer.
 
well, to address a number of things:

The beans are a gift and I suspect the person drinks drip coffee but I've asked. Local doesn't make much of a difference except to the extent it gets the beans to the recipient faster because I'll have it sent. I agree that most people over-extract - again, I have a very great espresso machine, I load it for a double and I do a short pull - delicious! Keurig makes too small of a cup!
 
originally posted by maureen:
well, to address a number of things:

Keurig makes too small of a cup!

Really? You must drink out of cup that's soon to be banned in NYC for being too large for soft drinks. The next-to-largest cup setting on my Keurig fills a 12 oz. mug. Don't know how many oz. for the largest, but I'm guessing at least 16.
 
I roast my own beans - usually pan-fried, but soon with a small Probat on loan from my suppliers. It's surprisingly easy and obviously fun.
 
originally posted by Larry Stein:
originally posted by maureen:
well, to address a number of things:

Keurig makes too small of a cup!

Really? You must drink out of cup that's soon to be banned in NYC for being too large for soft drinks. The next-to-largest cup setting on my Keurig fills a 12 oz. mug. Don't know how many oz. for the largest, but I'm guessing at least 16.
Maureen is making a double espresso, not an americano.
 
Silvia is kinda of the queen of the entry level espresso machines and should suit your needs well. The next step up usually involves an E61 group head, double boiler, PID, etc. and not to mention a $500+ grinder like you previously mentioned.
 
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