Need advice: cooking a large turkey

[mel hill]

sous vide your bird the Grant Achatz way!

part 2

 

[Jeff Connell]

originally posted by Todd Abrams:

originally posted by Jeff Connell:
I presume the milk and syrup are typically kept on the side?

Why would you presume that?

Milk punch is a classic New Orleans brunch cocktail.

Do you know the classic recipe for mint julep?

 

[Unknown]

3 oz. bourbon and 1.5-2 tablespoons mint-infused simple syrup* into glass with cracked ice, top with water, stir and garnish with a sprig of fresh mint.

*make simple syrup by heating equal parts water and sugar until sugar is dissolved. Add a bunch of mint while the syrup is still warm, crush the mint with a blunt object and let it steep for 5 minutes, strain. It will last a week in the fridge but tastes best immediately after making. I use this syrup for mojitos, too. I have a mint patch behind the garage with five types of mint for the purpose.

 

[Jeff Connell]

originally posted by Todd Abrams:
3 oz. bourbon and 1.5-2 tablespoons mint-infused simple syrup* into glass with cracked ice, top with water, stir and garnish with a sprig of fresh mint.

*make simple syrup by heating equal parts water and sugar until sugar is dissolved. Add a bunch of mint while the syrup is still warm, crush the mint with a blunt object and let it steep for 5 minutes, strain. It will last a week in the fridge but tastes best immediately after making. I use this syrup for mojitos, too. I have a mint patch behind the garage with five types of mint for the purpose.

That would be a personal mint julep. The classic recipe for mint julep goes something like this: prepare mint-infused cane syrup, pour over ice in a pitcher; take a small volume of bourbon, a fifth, say, pour into tall glasses. Facing into the wind, using the pitcher, toss the syrup over your left shoulder. Mint garnish optional.

 

[Unknown]

Faulkner might have been troubled to hear that.

Though I take it solely with ice half the time, I like bourbon in cocktails. The sometimes extreme charred barrel aroma and flavors work well with so many ingredients.

 

[Seth Hill]

I find rye works best in most of the cocktails I'd consider bourbon in, other than a whiskey smash. Which bourbon cocktails are your favorites, Todd?

-Seth, who's finishing his just-kicked-the-guests-out Final Ward and heading to bed.

-----------

Final Ward, a Last Word variation by Phil Ward of Death & Co., developed while he was at Pegu Club:

Equal parts:
-Rye whiskey
-Green Chartreuse
-Maraschino liqueur
-Lemon juice

Shake hard with ice, serve up in cocktail glass.

-----------

 

[Unknown]

I agree about the rye, with the exception of Milk Punch and Mint Julep. Bourbon seems to show well in these slightly sweeter and less complex cocktails.

The real issue for me is that I have access to a lot of different bourbon whiskies and only a few rye whiskies, so when I feel like a Manhattan or a Sazerac its usually bourbon I have on hand to mix one up. And it turns out fine.

The Final Ward sounds good. I havent experimented with chartreuse yet. I love maraschino! We went through nearly three bottles in the past couple years just making Aviations for everyone that stopped by. Its a wonderful aperitif.
2 oz. gin
3/4 oz. lemon juice
1/2 oz. maraschino
Shake with cracked ice and serve up with a cherry garnish.

 

[Jonathan Loesberg]

originally posted by Jay Miller:

originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
I've cooked 20 pound turkeys and I've done it with the stuffing inside. The only reason to cook the stuffing separately is health concerns. By the time the stuffing is done, the bird is burned. If the stuffing seems insufficiently hot when the bird is done, you can finish it separately. But if you like your stuffing redolent of turkey, you need to cook it in the bird at least initially.

What temp should stuffing be cooked to in order to kill bacteria? And if the stuffing is removed and put back in the oven after the bird is done is there still any danger from the interior cavity?

Sorry it's taken me so long to respond. I was in France eating Pintade for Thanksgiving,which avoids all these problems.

All bacteria that can cause harm, as I understand it, die at around 115-120 degrees. This is true even of trichinosis, thus making the practice of cooking pork until one is sure that it's dead an unnecessary tradition. One cooks poultry longer for taste reasons (you just wouldn't like it as rare as you probably like beef). A 20 lb. bird might have internal stuffing that did not reach even that temperature, however, and that is what causes the problem. If you're sure your stuffing is say 125 (you'll probably won't want it at less for taste reasons), you won't get ill.

 

[SFJoe]

originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:

Sorry it's taken me so long to respond. I was in France eating Pintade for Thanksgiving,which avoids all these problems. All bacteria that can cause harm, as I understand it, die at around 115-120 degrees. This is true even of trichinosis, thus making the practice of cooking pork until one is sure that it's dead an unnecessary tradition. One cooks poultry longer for taste reasons (you just wouldn't like it as rare as you probably like beef). A 20 lb. bird might have internal stuffing that did not reach even that temperature, however, and that is what causes the problem. If you're sure your stuffing is say 125 (you'll probably won't want it at less for taste reasons), you won't get ill.

I like pintade.

You may want to refresh your understanding of bacterial vulnerability. 115* really won't do anything but revv the suckers up. One general source from the CDC here. Another.

Most authorities would not regard 120* as even a safe holding temperature for cooked food.

Be careful out there.

 

[Jonathan Loesberg]

115 was clearly wrong and the result of not thinking. I'm going to claim a typo for 125. Most authorities regard any temperature lower than 140 as dangerous and they are right if you want to be on the safe side. But anybody who likes their steak even medium rare is probably eating it at 135 and those who like it rare probably ca 130 (we won't even talk about Porterhouse blue). I'm happy to yield to scientific knowledge and will if I can find someone who will say that the bacteria can actually live at 125-130. The job of the CDC is to keep me healthy, but not always happy with the state of the doneness of foods so one has to decide how to take their recommendations. If I listened to them, I'd never eat raw milk cheese either.

 

[SFJoe]

originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
115 was clearly wrong and the result of not thinking. I'm going to claim a typo for 125. Most authorities regard any temperature lower than 140 as dangerous and they are right if you want to be on the safe side. But anybody who likes their steak even medium rare is probably eating it at 135 and those who like it rare probably ca 130 (we won't even talk about Porterhouse blue). I'm happy to yield to scientific knowledge and will if I can find someone who will say that the bacteria can actually live at 125-130. The job of the CDC is to keep me healthy, but not always happy with the state of the doneness of foods so one has to decide how to take their recommendations. If I listened to them, I'd never eat raw milk cheese either.

Oh, I'm with you.

But there is a big difference between steak and, say, hamburger or chicken or what have you. Bacterial contamination of steak is usually on the surface, which reaches much higher temperatures than the interior. Unless you're one of the sous vide nut jobs. But hamburger can have E. coli O157 ground into it, and poultry can have high levels of Campylobacter or Salmonella.

I eat rare steak, and medium rare hamburgers if they've been ground in-store from just a piece or two of meat. But industrially ground meat should be cooked to death, IMO.

 

[JasonA]

Sous vide hamburgers? Time to revive that "Steamed Steaks" thread.