Red Premox

prunes, stewed fruits and dried figs
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I guess we have to distinguish from the cases where you smell all or some of the above from barrel !
 
originally posted by .sasha:
prunes, stewed fruits and dried figs
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I guess we have to distinguish from the cases where you smell all or some of the above from barrel !
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Well, that would be most of Bordeaux, these days, wouldn't it? Maybe they're just VERY prematurely oxidized.
 
originally posted by Claude Kolm:
Red PremoxU Bordeaux researchers.

One or two producers in Burgundy have long told me that they believe in it, too.
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There has never been any particular reason why it wouldn't happen, except that as he points out, reds have more redox buffer.

You raise my worst nightmare, really.
 
That article seems to be suggesting that some Bordeaux has a pH of over 4. I thought that was extremely high even for the new world?
 
originally posted by Oliver McCrum:
That article seems to be suggesting that some Bordeaux has a pH of over 4. I thought that was extremely high even for the new world?
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They get more purple that way.

But it's a revolting thought.
 
originally posted by Oliver McCrum:
That article seems to be suggesting that some Bordeaux has a pH of over 4. I thought that was extremely high even for the new world?
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Dominus 2004 is 4.0 pH (according to a search I did of the internet), so I should not be surprised with today's excesses some producers are above that limit.

A discussion on another board indicates that this may be a generalized problem these days for clarets, not random premox. If that's so, it's nothing more than we've known out here with CA wines for 30+ years -- a lot of wines crack up after a few years.
 
But ... I know that I've read both Parker and Rovani say that high acidity means that a wine won't age. What matters is the level of fruit. Obviously these wines must be underfruited so the thing to do is pick at even greater ripeness.
 
Underfruited wines won't age either.

Semantics perhaps?

I think we are back to the cockroaches thread.
 
originally posted by Claude Kolm:

Dominus 2004 is 4.0 pH
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I haven't had a vintage in the last 15 years, but I would have thought they would have been more reasonable. Did they totally go to the dark side?
 
originally posted by SFJoe:
originally posted by Claude Kolm:

Dominus 2004 is 4.0 pH
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I haven't had a vintage in the last 15 years, but I would have thought they would have been more reasonable. Did they totally go to the dark side?
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I think they were always quite high in pH (although the 2004 apparently is a record for the estate) -- I seem to recall Christian Moueix telling me that maybe 20 years ago, and I think the Moueix wines in Bordeaux also tend to be surprisingly high in pH.

I can attest that a 1990 opened a month ago was quite fresh and still had many years of life ahead of it.
 
originally posted by Jay Miller:
But ... I know that I've read both Parker and Rovani say that high acidity means that a wine won't age. What matters is the level of fruit. Obviously these wines must be underfruited so the thing to do is pick at even greater ripeness.
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Can I call you "Dr Big J" now?

Mark Lipton
 
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