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I tried, but I did not succeed (Grner Veltliner)
- Thread starter Sharon Bowman
- Start date
Saina Nieminen
Saina Nieminen
Another option would be to splurge on one of those Nikolaihof Vinotek bottles. I haven't seen as many notes on the Gruner Veltliner version compared to the Riesling.
The '91 GV Vinothek was lovely but seemed quite young on all tastes I had of it. I don't remember anyone else writing anything about it though.
Ignacio Villalgordo
Ignacio Villalgordo
Now that you mention it, we had a bottle of 91 vinothek about a month ago in the douro. It showed very well, and as you say seemed much younger than its 1991 tag. Our host was convinced it was a 2004.
Nevertheless, it failed to marvel me enough to rebuy another bottle. The importer still has some magnums of this, but they are 150 and to me is a bit too much for the wine we tasted
Nevertheless, it failed to marvel me enough to rebuy another bottle. The importer still has some magnums of this, but they are 150 and to me is a bit too much for the wine we tasted
originally posted by SFJoe:
Both great producers, obviously. FXP's wines since the mid-'90s have been awfully big, and I'd generally rather drink Durnsteiner Kellerberg riesling than any of his GVs.originally posted by Ignacio Villalgordo:
I am surprised nobody has mentioned FX Pichler or Nikolaihof...
I also love the rieslings at Nikolaihof, and probably give short shrift to the GVs.
It's like looking in to a mirror.
I'm in lock-step with Mssr. SF.
originally posted by MarkS:
Hey, y'all can't like EVERYTHING under the sun, especially when you are particular of the what you ask the grape to delever. Move on. There are many more vines in the world to discover. Although, I hasten to add, that GV is an aromatic variety, so yours would be an unusual example.
I think it's worth the time to try to figure out gruner veltliner. At least try a few more.
You don't have to like everything, I pretty much restrict my sauvignon consumption to Vatan and the odd bottle of Cotat these days. A few sprikled in here and there, but not much.
I rarely have use for grenache based wines either.
originally posted by Ignacio Villalgordo:
Now that you mention it, we had a bottle of 91 vinothek about a month ago in the douro. It showed very well, and as you say seemed much younger than its 1991 tag. Our host was convinced it was a 2004.
Well, it is kept in inert storage for 13 years or something before it is bottled I believe.
originally posted by MLipton:
originally posted by Jay Miller:
Actually, the Nikolaihoff [sic] Hefeabzug is a good inexpensive introduction. Buy 2 bottles, drink one know, the second in 5 or 6 years. That should give you a good idea of whether you like Gruner for very little money and you can then expand to higher end bottlings.
I am probably in the minority, but I've never been taken with the Hefeabzug bottling. My starter GV recommendation would be a Federspiel from a quality producer such as Knoll.
Knoll Grner Veltliner Smaragd Loibenberg
Hirtzberger Grner Veltliner Federspiel Rotes Tor
I think that the Knoll is generally underpriced for its very high quality.
These days I'm pretty much of the opinion that opening a decent GV at less than age 10 is a bit of a waste.
Interesting. Is that true across all Prdikat levels? I can't see aging Federspiels (or, for that matter, Steinfeders if you can find them in the US) for that long, but YMMV in a Connellian sorta way.
Mark Lipton
I think I like mine medium. This is a tricky question about the aging curve on these Wachau and other high quality riesling and gruner veltliner wines. No less an authority than David Schildknecht has said he has no idea since there isn't much of a historical precedent for what is being made today.
I'm pretty sure I like my wine with a little more youthful vigor than Jeff does though.
U
Unknown
Guest
I really liked a magnum of 86 hirtzberger honivogl gv recently.
It was delicious but tasty. Sharon would have enjoyed it, but she was at a different location at the time.
It was delicious but tasty. Sharon would have enjoyed it, but she was at a different location at the time.
originally posted by .sasha:
I really liked a magnum of 86 hirtzberger honivogl gv recently.
Damn. Where do you uncover gems like this?
Lucky dog.
U
Unknown
Guest
Not to mention I was not worthy.
Claude Kolm
Claude Kolm
As opposed to??? Delicious but not tasty? Can you elaborate?originally posted by .sasha:
It was delicious but tasty.
U
Unknown
Guest
originally posted by SFJoe:
Was that the famous Honivogl Honifogl, so beloved of Austrian crossword puzzlers and trivia buffs?
Yes. And the worst part, I was too drunk to remember the explanation. There is a story there, isn't there, one worth telling?
U
Unknown
Guest
originally posted by Claude Kolm:
As opposed to??? Delicious but not tasty? Can you elaborate?originally posted by .sasha:
It was delicious but tasty.
As opposed to tasty but delicious. This all becomes clear once you get past the etymological honivogl/honifogl mystery.
originally posted by .sasha:
originally posted by SFJoe:
Was that the famous Honivogl Honifogl, so beloved of Austrian crossword puzzlers and trivia buffs?
Yes. And the worst part, I was too drunk to remember the explanation. There is a story there, isn't there, one worth telling?
Not to build it up too far.
I wasn't at the Vinea Wachau when they were making their decisions, but my understanding is that "Honifogl" was the precursor designation for a brief period (1986 vintage) for ripeness levels currently covered as "Smaragd," i.e., with potential alcohol greater than (12? 12.5%?). I had thought that "Honifogl" was a tip of the hat to the famous "Honivogl" vineyard, which is a warm site and consistently delivers GV of this ripeness.
So in 1986 there is one wine in Austria that is both "Honivogl" (vineyard), and "Honifogl" (ripeness level of the Vinea Wachau growers association). Hahahahaha, a macho pedant knee-slapper, no?
But it's a fine vintage and a delicious wine and a most amusing label.
U
Unknown
Guest
"Brundlmayer Alte Reben"
2nd.
and 3rd.
2nd.
and 3rd.
U
Unknown
Guest
originally posted by SFJoe:
originally posted by .sasha:
originally posted by SFJoe:
Was that the famous Honivogl Honifogl, so beloved of Austrian crossword puzzlers and trivia buffs?
Yes. And the worst part, I was too drunk to remember the explanation. There is a story there, isn't there, one worth telling?
Not to build it up too far.
I wasn't at the Vinea Wachau when they were making their decisions, but my understanding is that "Honifogl" was the precursor designation for a brief period (1986 vintage) for ripeness levels currently covered as "Smaragd," i.e., with potential alcohol greater than (12? 12.5%?). I had thought that "Honifogl" was a tip of the hat to the famous "Honivogl" vineyard, which is a warm site and consistently delivers GV of this ripeness.
So in 1986 there is one wine in Austria that is both "Honivogl" (vineyard), and "Honifogl" (ripeness level of the Vinea Wachau growers association). Hahahahaha, a macho pedant knee-slapper, no?
But it's a fine vintage and a delicious wine and a most amusing label.
My latest source who could only be identified as FMH appears to be in near agreement. Latest rumours claim "honifogl" was a derivative of "honivogel", the "honeybird" which legend says would not touch the berry until it had reached its maximum ripeness, 12.5% at the time. It is not clear if the bird has recalibrated for the global warming. And indeed, there was a Frau Honifogl who had tried to use name protection laws to her advantage, but whose extortionist nature was not well received by the Vinea Wachau, so the designation was rebranded a year later.
originally posted by .sasha:
Latest rumours claim "honifogl" was a derivative of "honivogel", the "honeybird" which legend says would not touch the berry until it had reached its maximum ripeness, 12.5% at the time.
Presumably, that was actually "Honigvogel," nicht wahr?
Mark Lipton