Wassail

Quick unedited thoughts on the cider thing.

I drink cider fairly often. I think it matches well with a wide variety of dishes (but not anything involving tomatoes or olives) and is actually superior to most wines with strong or unsubtle cheeses.

Cider is one of the "is it the next big thing?" products in the trade, with both a host of crafty producers springing up and some big companies heavily investing. Still, it's pretty amazing to see an all-cider premise, even in NYC. I look forward to visiting.

The American hard cider-producing tradition withered away in the 20th century, and there are no established expectations of what cider should taste like. We're presented with a riot of very different styles: stuff that tastes like apple beer, funky bretty rustic to ripe appley fruit, austere verjus-like products and synthetic-tasting soda-cider.

I'm surprised by how dry and how lacking in fruit are many of the new wave of craft ciders. Sweet fruit balanced with tangy acid are the hallmarks of fresh apples, so it's somewhat jarring. It's like the IPAzation of cider, and I don't think it's going to make a lot of converts. If the larger commercial brands go sweet (I've only had a few of them and they varied), then cider might end up with the artificial and annoying "good wines=dry, bad wines=sweet" bifurcation that burdened the wine category for years.

I suspect some of this is related to the background or tastes of the domestic craft producers being more rooted in beer than wine or Norman cider. I wish more domestic producers would emulate the Norman model, where you can find both good appley fruit and complexity, in sweet (or at least demi-sec) and dry ciders. For that matter, I wish more of the Norman producers were imported and distributed here.
 
Thanks, Christian. That makes a lot of sense.

I agree with you and Kay that strong cheese can be nice with cider. Maybe I don't go that direction because cheese is usually a last part of a meal rather than a pre-meal nibble, in my France-addled mind.
 
originally posted by Sharon Bowman:
...and he told us the chef was making a traditional (from where?) drink involving fermented pineapple rinds. They're not ready to start serving it yet, but he went in the back and brought us out a sample. It was very tasty.

Mexico traditional. Tepache is pretty popular out here in the desert as a cocktail modifier.
 
When i was a kid some big company (coke?) was test marketing a carbonated apple juice that came in cans in six-packs. Called Apple Beer. I loved it. Was not around long.
 
originally posted by Christian Miller (CMM):

The American hard cider-producing tradition withered away in the 20th century, and there are no established expectations of what cider should taste like. We're presented with a riot of very different styles: stuff that tastes like apple beer, funky bretty rustic to ripe appley fruit, austere verjus-like products and synthetic-tasting soda-cider.

I'm surprised by how dry and how lacking in fruit are many of the new wave of craft ciders. Sweet fruit balanced with tangy acid are the hallmarks of fresh apples, so it's somewhat jarring. It's like the IPAzation of cider, and I don't think it's going to make a lot of converts.

I think a big part of this is the use of table apples to make hard cider. Orchards growing true cider varieties are following the trend of production in the US, not leading it.

The very best unpasteurized juice available from one of my local orchards makes a simple, dry cider that has more in common with American macro lager than wine.
 
originally posted by Christian Miller (CMM):
...

Cider is one of the "is it the next big thing?" products in the trade, with both a host of crafty producers springing up and some big companies heavily investing...

Even little Lewisburg, PA, has had a local cider producer, Civil War Cider, for about a year and a half. They opened a cider pub called Bushel & Barrel almost a year ago. I have to confess I haven't yet tried their wares, though it's on my list.
 
originally posted by Todd Abrams:
originally posted by Christian Miller (CMM):

The American hard cider-producing tradition withered away in the 20th century, and there are no established expectations of what cider should taste like. We're presented with a riot of very different styles: stuff that tastes like apple beer, funky bretty rustic to ripe appley fruit, austere verjus-like products and synthetic-tasting soda-cider.

I'm surprised by how dry and how lacking in fruit are many of the new wave of craft ciders. Sweet fruit balanced with tangy acid are the hallmarks of fresh apples, so it's somewhat jarring. It's like the IPAzation of cider, and I don't think it's going to make a lot of converts.

I think a big part of this is the use of table apples to make hard cider. Orchards growing true cider varieties are following the trend of production in the US, not leading it.

Exactly. Few are the farms that started by planting ancient varieties (most of which make pretty terrible table fruit). I do look forward to more apple distillates rather than ciders made from golden delicious or some other insipid variety.
 
originally posted by scottreiner:
originally posted by Steve Guattery:
Lewisburg, PA

Bucknell or the Penitentiary? I went to Bucknell.

I'm at Bucknell, though whenever my-brother-the-lawyer tells his colleagues he's going to visit his brother in Lewisburg, they ask "What's he in for?"

When were you there/what did you study? Definitely stop in if you get back this way.
 
Holy crow, it's really a place you can't walk by without tripping and entering. I.e., the food is delicious, even for just a snack, and the wine list is well-thought, even by the glass.

And it's air-conditioned and comfortable, and the sommelier Jason is always finding new things and is a great person to talk with about wine.

All of that said, I err sometimes on the side of not stumbling by as often as I should. It's 5 minutes on foot from me, but would be worth the "detour" even were it further.

The other bartenders are also genial and welcoming.

If I were Kirk, I would be there more than once a week.
 
originally posted by Steve Guattery:
originally posted by scottreiner:
originally posted by Steve Guattery:
Lewisburg, PA

Bucknell or the Penitentiary? I went to Bucknell.

I'm at Bucknell, though whenever my-brother-the-lawyer tells his colleagues he's going to visit his brother in Lewisburg, they ask "What's he in for?"

When were you there/what did you study? Definitely stop in if you get back this way.

I graduated undergraduate in '94; I was an IR major with a minor in development economics.

Richard Peterec was my advisor, but I imagine he must have retired.

I'll definitely give word if I make it to Central PA, but I can't imagine that happening any time soon....
 
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