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TN: Downton Abbey makes me want to drink
- Thread starter Kay Bixler
- Start date
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
Oxidized '09s - aghh!
I'm finding, by contrast, that aging can do a lot for these wines - 2002 L-P Excelsior Poyets got really good in the past year. I've found the Briords to become quite a bit more relaxed and integrated = more pleasant to drink after a period of shut-down.
FWIW, a recent 05 Clisson from magnum was very fresh and youtful.
Allees can be awfully good.
That's great. I think we may be looking for different things. Even tasting old vintages in situ with Marc I found that I wasn't as taken with the aged versions (with a couple of notable exceptions). They were different, I just don't think the flavor profile is for me. I have aged previously Muscadets, including Allées, L d'Or, Bossard, Landron, etc., it's not that I don't have experience or expertise, I just don't think it gets them to a better place than they are over the short term. Especially with things like the Quatre and Clisson that are "pre-aged" they come in about where I want them form the get-go.
So not really oxidized, just older than you would like them to taste?
I would call them oxidized. Noel and Mark have both tasted examples with me of said wines.
In addition, I think I prefer the younger profile of Muscadet.
Yup. It was prematurely oxidized for sure. 2007 Clisson out of magnum, I believe.
originally posted by mark e:
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
Oxidized '09s - aghh!
I'm finding, by contrast, that aging can do a lot for these wines - 2002 L-P Excelsior Poyets got really good in the past year. I've found the Briords to become quite a bit more relaxed and integrated = more pleasant to drink after a period of shut-down.
FWIW, a recent 05 Clisson from magnum was very fresh and youtful.
Allees can be awfully good.
That's great. I think we may be looking for different things. Even tasting old vintages in situ with Marc I found that I wasn't as taken with the aged versions (with a couple of notable exceptions). They were different, I just don't think the flavor profile is for me. I have aged previously Muscadets, including Allées, L d'Or, Bossard, Landron, etc., it's not that I don't have experience or expertise, I just don't think it gets them to a better place than they are over the short term. Especially with things like the Quatre and Clisson that are "pre-aged" they come in about where I want them form the get-go.
So not really oxidized, just older than you would like them to taste?
I would call them oxidized. Noel and Mark have both tasted examples with me of said wines.
In addition, I think I prefer the younger profile of Muscadet.
Yup. It was prematurely oxidized for sure. 2007 Clisson out of magnum, I believe.
A huge disappointment given the general excellence of that wine.
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by mark e:
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
Oxidized '09s - aghh!
I'm finding, by contrast, that aging can do a lot for these wines - 2002 L-P Excelsior Poyets got really good in the past year. I've found the Briords to become quite a bit more relaxed and integrated = more pleasant to drink after a period of shut-down.
FWIW, a recent 05 Clisson from magnum was very fresh and youtful.
Allees can be awfully good.
That's great. I think we may be looking for different things. Even tasting old vintages in situ with Marc I found that I wasn't as taken with the aged versions (with a couple of notable exceptions). They were different, I just don't think the flavor profile is for me. I have aged previously Muscadets, including Allées, L d'Or, Bossard, Landron, etc., it's not that I don't have experience or expertise, I just don't think it gets them to a better place than they are over the short term. Especially with things like the Quatre and Clisson that are "pre-aged" they come in about where I want them form the get-go.
So not really oxidized, just older than you would like them to taste?
I would call them oxidized. Noel and Mark have both tasted examples with me of said wines.
In addition, I think I prefer the younger profile of Muscadet.
Yup. It was prematurely oxidized for sure. 2007 Clisson out of magnum, I believe.
A huge disappointment given the general excellence of that wine.
I, too, prefer them younger. I can't imagine that 2014 Briords is going to get much better than it is now. But until now the 2014 classique tasted better, but it is the other way around - at least for me - based on a couple of side-by-side comparisons.
Jonathan Loesberg
Jonathan Loesberg
I had the 07 Clisson, from 750 yesterday, and it did indeed show oxidization. I now have to taste my 09s and 12s in the near term. I have yet to taste an oxidized Briords though.
Jonathan Loesberg
Jonathan Loesberg
I was surprised by the Clisson because my Briords and Luneau-Papins have aged so well. I don't have anything going back older than 02, but none of them that I have drunk over the last year or so have been anything but great. While they do get somewhat fuller, they don't, at least of the ones I have, lose their nerviness. I will be curious to see whether the Clisson and, as Nathan says, its lies vinifying leads to this or whether this is a thing that happened to the 07s. I have to say that the 05 I had, thanks to Ian, was still young and beautiful. It was in magnum.
Ian Fitzsimmons
Ian Fitzsimmons
I opened an 09 Clisson on Saturday, and it was fine, though less exiciting than I might have hoped. I'd be inclined to think it was in a quiet phase, its highlights temporarily in repose, but who knows? One datum.
I'll rummage around for another 07 soon; my last was in May, and I wrote this note in CT:
"Much more interesting than the last bottle, so perhaps coming through the other side of an awkward or shut-down period. Different from its youthful self, the wine now shows more depth, complexity, and saline pungency, which I'm beginning to read as a signature of well-made, well-aged Muscadet."
Another datum.
I'll rummage around for another 07 soon; my last was in May, and I wrote this note in CT:
"Much more interesting than the last bottle, so perhaps coming through the other side of an awkward or shut-down period. Different from its youthful self, the wine now shows more depth, complexity, and saline pungency, which I'm beginning to read as a signature of well-made, well-aged Muscadet."
Another datum.
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
I opened an 09 Clisson on Saturday, and it was fine, though less exiciting than I might have hoped. I'd be inclined to think it was in a quite phase, its highlights temporarily in repose, but who knows? One datum.
I'll rummage around for another 07 soon; my last was in May, and I wrote this note in CT:
"Much more interesting than the last bottle, so perhaps coming through the other side of an awkward or shut-down period. Different from its youthful self, the wine now shows more depth, complexity, and saline pungency, which I'm beginning to read as a sigunature of well-made, well-aged Muscadet."
Please do soon. I think I might grab the 3L for an event Saturday. Be a team player!
Ian Fitzsimmons
Ian Fitzsimmons
Two typos in my quoted message - apologies.
I'll do my best. I'm on my own now, though, so the rate of intake has dropped sharply, and mostly occurs on the weekends. Personally, I'd place the bet - 3 liters of 07 Clisson? Irresistable.
I'll do my best. I'm on my own now, though, so the rate of intake has dropped sharply, and mostly occurs on the weekends. Personally, I'd place the bet - 3 liters of 07 Clisson? Irresistable.
Kay Bixler
Kay Bixler
Hey Nathan, I mostly agree with you about aging Muscadet. The only problem is the exceptions, many noted in this thread, can be so remarkable I always feel the need to keep losing bottles in the cellar. '99 Allies for example and '04 Briords, some '95s opened a couple years ago, all have been otherworldly. It's just hard to taste them young and know which will last.
originally posted by Kay Bixler:
Hey Nathan, I mostly agree with you about aging Muscadet. The only problem is the exceptions, many noted in this thread, can be so remarkable I always feel the need to keep losing bottles in the cellar. '99 Allies for example and '04 Briords, some '95s opened a couple years ago, all have been otherworldly. It's just hard to taste them young and know which will last.
That's been my problem. I thought for sure that 2010 Briords would be like 2002, but no such luck. For me, I love Marc's wines so much, it really isn't a burden to drink them in the first several years.
Ian Fitzsimmons
Ian Fitzsimmons
FWIW, my '09 Clisson smoothed and became deeper/more interesting over a couple of days after opening. I'm putting the '07 Clisson and '09 Briords in the bull pen.
What are thoughts on the '12 Clisson? I drank half a bottle a few months ago, which my wife had opened, and I thought would be too young for my preferences, but it was positively dreamy.
What are thoughts on the '12 Clisson? I drank half a bottle a few months ago, which my wife had opened, and I thought would be too young for my preferences, but it was positively dreamy.
originally posted by Ian Fitzsimmons:
FWIW, my '09 Clisson smoothed and became deeper/more interesting over a couple of days after opening. I'm putting the '07 Clisson and '09 Briords in the bull pen.
What are thoughts on the '12 Clisson? I drank half a bottle a few months ago, which my wife had opened, and I thought would be too young for my preferences, but it was positively dreamy.
I love the 2012 and have been drinking it out of 750 and 1.5L without a second thought. I keep all of it at the house now, so it won't make old bones, I'm afraid.
Ian Fitzsimmons
Ian Fitzsimmons
I already have more bottles of the '12 than is prudent, given my rate of consumption, so I'll probably - as Kay puts it - lose a few in my cellar, which has already become a kind of Burmuda Triangle for wine bottles. Science will thank me in the years to come.
Good luck tomorrow.
Good luck tomorrow.
Larry Stein
Larry Stein
Any thoughts on '10 Clisson? Somehow, I have a single bottle in the cellar.
Ian Fitzsimmons
Ian Fitzsimmons
'09 Briords is drinking nicely, no rush.
Jonathan Loesberg
Jonathan Loesberg
We had the 09 Clisson from 750s yesterday. Not a spec of ox. Creamier than usual for Pepiere but it always was. Really still young. Maybe there was something different about the 07s. Or maybe the 09s will fall over dead in 2 more years. But I am less alarmed.
A few days earlier, just by the way, we had an 05 Brezeme (regular cuvee). It was wonderful, certainly ready to drink but not in any danger of going over the hill. It got better with a couple of hours of airing.
A few days earlier, just by the way, we had an 05 Brezeme (regular cuvee). It was wonderful, certainly ready to drink but not in any danger of going over the hill. It got better with a couple of hours of airing.