TN: Dinner with Wolfgang

D

David from Switzerland

David Plattner
Henri Bonneau Chateauneuf-du-Pape Réserve des Célestins 2009
L.014 Deep, fresh pruney garnet-red, virtually opaque at the centre. Fruity on the nose, but on the palate has clearly lost fruit compared to the barrel tasting, a bit tighter, less opulent and more dusty-tannic as a result. Still a fruity and well-focused, precise vintage, well-balanced and harmonious, with perfectly integrated alcohol. Complex, but not the depth of the greatest vintages. An as if newer oak marzipan top note (the only other Bonneaus to show this and seem more modern than usual were 2003 and 2004). Some dried ginger, juniper, prune, meat juice, soft herbs and spices. Quite long. Not one of the sweaty vintages, nicely clean for Bonneau. Judging from the barrel sample I had expected the 2009 to be one of those vintages that would always be open and provide pleasure, but tasting it from bottle now it may be on its way to close down, probably best to wait for a few more years (although maybe not the full twenty years Wolfgang proposes). dp 94+/95

Churchill's Vintage Port 1985
Thanks to Wolfgang. Plummy ruby-black. Sweet fruit, dried violet, milk chocolate, honey melon. Reminiscent of (pre-Symington era) Graham. Medium-plus weight. Nicely firm tannin. Barely any volatility at all (a bottle in 1997 was so volatile, I decided against buying any). Quite long. One of the best 1985 Vintage Ports at this stage of their evolution (Wolfgang thinks second or third best of the vintage). Lovely! dp 92

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
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J'ai gaché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ Roger Conti
 
Thanks, David. I always worry about "pruney" as an adjective for wine. It seems not complimentary to me - prunes are extremely sweet and lack acidity (which is why they sell them with lemon oil or orange oil sprinkled on). Did you mean it this way, or were you just being very plum-variety-specific?
 
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Thanks, David. I always worry about "pruney" as an adjective for wine. It seems not complimentary to me - prunes are extremely sweet and lack acidity (which is why they sell them with lemon oil or orange oil sprinkled on). Did you mean it this way, or were you just being very plum-variety-specific?
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Variety-specific! I do realize some use the term to refer to oxidative style wine-making in contrast to plum, which most associate with e.g. Vintage Port, but sweet and lacking in acidity certainly isn't what springs to mind considering the prunes we grow e.g. in our garden (the ancient indigenous Swiss variety which has a blue-black skin, firm yellowish green pulp with purple sprinkles where in contact with the stone, a complex and refreshing flavor profile, and excellent balance of acidity and bitter notes - one needs to add an almost equal amount of e.g. beet sugar to cook compote or preserves):

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Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

J'ai gaché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ Roger Conti
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originally posted by kirk wallace:
your backyard plums sound fantastic!
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They are! Unfortunately, the indigenous variety is susceptible to mildew, which can be a problem when autumn is wet, as the prunes are fairly sour and lightly bitter harvested prematurely. But they taste much better (more complex and subtle) than modern, low-acid varieties. Even so, they're becoming a rare sight.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

J'ai gaché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ Roger Conti
 
That sounds fantastic. When I used to spend summers in the Berry, we had a tree in the garden that gave little yellow-green plums, smaller than mirabelles. I believe they were called "sirots." I would pick them, halve them, take out any worms and make tarts with them. So delicious.
 
originally posted by Sharon Bowman:
That sounds fantastic. When I used to spend summers in the Berry, we had a tree in the garden that gave little yellow-green plums, smaller than mirabelles. I believe they were called "sirots." I would pick them, halve them, take out any worms and make tarts with them. So delicious.
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Luckily, we usually have enough to be able and throw out all that have mildew or worms - except this year there were so few we ate them all fresh from the tree!

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

J'ai gaché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ Roger Conti
 
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
originally posted by David from Switzerland:

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Damsons! Yes, those are good plums.
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Right. Although we're calling the British ones "damsons", smaller and more astringent, almost exclusively used to make damson paste to go with e.g. cheese, as they're almost inedible picked from the tree. But they're both "prunus domestica" varieties.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

J'ai gaché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ Roger Conti
 
originally posted by David from Switzerland:
But they're both "prunus domestica" varieties.
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Aren't all plums from that species?

I have no plum trees near me but I do have farmer's markets and supermarkets. We get ten or so varieties of plums. And pluots. (And other Frankenfruit.)

Some Empress plums recently were just tasteless. I'm going to focus on the last of the season's figs.
 
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
originally posted by David from Switzerland:
But they're both "prunus domestica" varieties.
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Aren't all plums from that species?

I have no plum trees near me but I do have farmer's markets and supermarkets. We get ten or so varieties of plums. And pluots. (And other Frankenfruit.)

Some Empress plums recently were just tasteless. I'm going to focus on the last of the season's figs.
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That's a bummer, but the reason we have our own tree: can't get the indigenous variety at the market, farmers prefer growing more modern varieties that withstand the mould.

Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________

J'ai gaché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ Roger Conti
 
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
I have no plum trees near me but I do have farmer's markets and supermarkets. We get ten or so varieties of plums. And pluots. (And other Frankenfruit.)

Some Empress plums recently were just tasteless. I'm going to focus on the last of the season's figs.
Click to expand...

Jeff, have you had good plums in the U.S.? I never have.
 
originally posted by Sharon Bowman:
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
I have no plum trees near me but I do have farmer's markets and supermarkets. We get ten or so varieties of plums. And pluots. (And other Frankenfruit.)

Some Empress plums recently were just tasteless. I'm going to focus on the last of the season's figs.
Click to expand...

Jeff, have you had good plums in the U.S.? I never have.
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From time to time. It helps to be on friendly terms with the greengrocer: she knows what she's got.
 
originally posted by Sharon Bowman:
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
I have no plum trees near me but I do have farmer's markets and supermarkets. We get ten or so varieties of plums. And pluots. (And other Frankenfruit.)

Some Empress plums recently were just tasteless. I'm going to focus on the last of the season's figs.
Click to expand...

Jeff, have you had good plums in the U.S.? I never have.
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I have, though I loved the damascene (damson plums) I used to buy in Italy. For those on the west coast I recommend Guru Ram Das Orchards which sells every Saturday at the downtown Berkeley Farmers' Market. Superb fresh and dried Laroda plums. I've also had plenty of great Santa Rosa and Greengage plums over the years, but never on the East Coast.
 
originally posted by Sharon Bowman:

Jeff, have you had good plums in the U.S.? I never have.
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As noted below, are you particularly discerning in your plum appreciation or have you just not spent time eating them on the west coast?
 
originally posted by Rahsaan:
As noted below, are you particularly discerning in your plum appreciation or have you just not spent time eating them on the west coast?
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Never had any on the west coast. (Per Mark, I've consistently missed the season.)
 
originally posted by Sharon Bowman:
originally posted by Rahsaan:
As noted below, are you particularly discerning in your plum appreciation or have you just not spent time eating them on the west coast?
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Never had any on the west coast. (Per Mark, I've consistently missed the season.)
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Alas, that does not coincide with mushroom season.
 
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