TN: Juge Vertical in NYC (June 3, 2018)

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Vinyl is a manifestation of analog retentiveness.
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Bravo.
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Is the general idea here to express disconnected views on music recordings, Art, food, sports, cars, etc., or to maintain consistency between your views on wine and those on aforementioned topics?
 
originally posted by Pavel Tchichikov:
originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
Vinyl is a manifestation of analog retentiveness.
Click to expand...
Bravo.
Click to expand...

Is the general idea here to express disconnected views on music recordings, Art, food, sports, cars, etc., or to maintain consistency between your views on wine and those on aforementioned topics?
Click to expand...

I'd guess most of us understand why so many natural wine bars play vinyl. Even though DSD512 sounds pretty good on decent equipment, it does sound different. So the answer (pretty obviously) to your question is to maintain consistency.
 
I realized tonight that the bottle of 2015 Gilles Cornas I have left on the counter for three weeks has a full pour left. And hot damn, if it isn’t still drinking in a loamy, purple fruit, play-doh smell sort of way?! Tangy rich fruit on the finish. Almost no sign of oxidation.

I suspect this one will be long-lived. Tune back in in 12 years for Round 2.
 
In Levi's latest excellent interview, Jacques Seysses says right after the 17 minute mark that he used whole cluster (in his time) not because of the stems, but because of the whole berries which, by virtue of being whole, undergo an initial intracelular fermentation. If says that if he could destem and still retain whole berries, he would (because cleaning destemming machines is a major hassle, he says a bit before).
 
originally posted by Jayson Cohen:
I realized tonight that the bottle of 2015 Gilles Cornas I have left on the counter for three weeks has a full pour left. And hot damn, if it isn’t still drinking in a loamy, purple fruit, play-doh smell sort of way?! Tangy rich fruit on the finish. Almost no sign of oxidation.
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Cornas *is* rather loamy, isn't it?
 
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
In Levi's latest excellent interview, Jacques Seysses says right after the 17 minute mark that he used whole cluster (in his time) not because of the stems, but because of the whole berries which, by virtue of being whole, undergo an initial intracelular fermentation. If says that if he could destem and still retain whole berries, he would (because cleaning destemming machines is a major hassle, he says a bit before).
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Yes. i think I knew this. IIRC Jacques learned this from his time in the Rhône in the 60s. But I don’t recall who he was working with. Maybe with Clape?
 
originally posted by Jayson Cohen:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
In Levi's latest excellent interview, Jacques Seysses says right after the 17 minute mark that he used whole cluster (in his time) not because of the stems, but because of the whole berries which, by virtue of being whole, undergo an initial intracelular fermentation. If says that if he could destem and still retain whole berries, he would (because cleaning destemming machines is a major hassle, he says a bit before).
Click to expand...

Yes. i think I knew this. IIRC Jacques learned this from his time in the Rhône in the 60s. But I don’t recall who he was working with. Maybe with Clape?
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He mentions meeting Chave and Clape but says nothing about being influenced by them; his main role model was Gérard Potel at Pousse d'Or, as well as DRC's use of whole cluster. Later, if I recall correctly, he adopted some of Christophe Roumier's practices.

What I found a bit confusing was his use of the term "cold fermentation," which allows the maceration to last longer before actual fermentation starts. He was clearly talking about the (naturally) very cold cellars, but the term these days seems employed to mean artificial cooling to extract more fruit, often resulting in a tutti Frutti sameness.
 
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
He was clearly talking about the (naturally) very cold cellars, but the term these days seems employed to mean artificial cooling to extract more fruit, often resulting in a tutti Frutti sameness.
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I don't see much wrong in cooling the must to slightly extend fermentation time. I believe that "tutti frutti" character comes more from selected yeast strains. But I am happy to hear from those with more experience about the merits of a longer cooler fermentation for red wines vs. a rapid, hot one.
 
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:

What I found a bit confusing was his use of the term "cold fermentation," which allows the maceration to last longer before actual fermentation starts. He was clearly talking about the (naturally) very cold cellars, but the term these days seems employed to mean artificial cooling to extract more fruit, often resulting in a tutti Frutti sameness.
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Sounds like what Guy Accad used to advocate when he was consulting in Burgundy.
 
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:

What I found a bit confusing was his use of the term "cold fermentation," which allows the maceration to last longer before actual fermentation starts. He was clearly talking about the (naturally) very cold cellars, but the term these days seems employed to mean artificial cooling to extract more fruit, often resulting in a tutti Frutti sameness.
Click to expand...

Sounds like what Guy Accad used to advocate when he was consulting in Burgundy.
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No Accad advocated for prolonged cold soaks, up to 21 days, with lots of sulfur and cold temperatures to preserve the must. Those old Grivots looked like syrah.
 
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