2013 Morgon, Foillard and Descombes

[Rahsaan]

These were my last bottles of each. And after some middling showings over the past year I thought I might hold onto the final bottles for a while. Oh well. Plans change and things get opened.

2013 Foillard Côte du Py
In this case, what a wonderful time to be opened. Dare I even say the perfect timing for my palate. Maturing and mellowing but still juicy. An elegant feather that glides across the tongue but still has snap and sap. Gains a bit of depth after several hours of air but I won't lose any sleep worrying about where it will evolve. This was a fun fun time. And much appreciated after a long hard day.

2013 Descombes Morgon VV
This on the other hand probably could have used more time. Darker, tighter, and more about the structure. Takes several hours of air to loosen and express that lovely Descombes stony rocky lacy fruit. Much clearer fruit here than in the Foillard, which was drifting off into the clouds. This is firm and rooted. It does give a nice dose of pleasure and was not a chore to swallow. But in the end am left thinking about potential.

Will have to remind myself (again) that I don't necessarily need to drink these wines in vintage pairs.

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

A rule of five would not work with Descombes.

 

[robert ames]

i've got a magnum of jean-paul thevenet morgon vieille vignes that i've been hanging on to for a good while now. any advice on the evolution of this one?

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

originally posted by robert ames:
i've got a magnum of jean-paul thevenet morgon vieille vignes that i've been hanging on to for a good while now. any advice on the evolution of this one?

Be kind, give us the vintage.

 

[robert ames]

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:

originally posted by robert ames:
i've got a magnum of jean-paul thevenet morgon vieille vignes that i've been hanging on to for a good while now. any advice on the evolution of this one?

Be kind, give us the vintage.

oh yes, sorry, it's 2011.

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

originally posted by robert ames:

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:

originally posted by robert ames:
i've got a magnum of jean-paul thevenet morgon vieille vignes that i've been hanging on to for a good while now. any advice on the evolution of this one?

Be kind, give us the vintage.

oh yes, sorry, it's 2011.

I drank many bottles of the 2004 750ml and they were ideal between ages 5 and 10. I also imported directly the 2012 for a group of friends in Brazil and it was still a few years from ready in 2015. 2011 and 2012 are probably not too dissimilar, so I'd expect a 750ml of the 2011 to be already pleasurable. Not sure how much of an adjustment to make for a magnum, but if we add two or three years, then a 2011 magnum would be at the beginning of its drinking window and probably in the optimal band starting in two or three years, depending on how much development v. freshness one wants.

 

[Pavel Tchichikov]

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
2011 and 2012 are probably not too dissimilar

???!!!

Perhaps in that they can be approached in a similar time frame. Sure. That's where the similarities end. But even there I would argue - and this is personal and palate-specific - that while you *have* to drink 2011s sooner rather than later, you *can* (but don't have to) drink the 2012s early.

 

[Pavel Tchichikov]

This seems like as good a place as any to report.

Pulled this last night because of a bizarre pairing challenge of baked green apples stuffed with ground beef, raisins, cinnamon, onions, chickpeas, etc.

Loved the wine. What's this 5-year rule the politburo goes on about? I missed the memo.

I wanted ripe, and I got ripe. Very healthy and balanced ripe. Reserved aromas of great promise, expressing more and more dusty stones with each pour. MaV vs 09 on the palate; MaV wins. Dense and muscular, layered; but tannins are ultimately rounded and ripe, if never soft. Great deep red cherry flavors. Over time, doing the you've been rewarded for drinking me slowly thing with sappiness and hints of exotic "red citrus" borne of low-ish acidity, never losing shape.

10-year rule subscribers, if any, may love this right now. There is not enough JPB in my cellar.

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

originally posted by Pavel Tchichikov:

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
2011 and 2012 are probably not too dissimilar

???!!!

Perhaps in that they can be approached in a similar time frame. Sure. That's where the similarities end. But even there I would argue - and this is personal and palate-specific - that while you *have* to drink 2011s sooner rather than later, you *can* (but don't have to) drink the 2012s early.

I was thinking drinking window, regional maturity levels, and rot, but if you're talking about conditions specifically in Morgon, I don't know and would have to concede.

 

[Lee Short]

Had a bottle of the 2000 Brun M-a-V recently, and it seemed just about ready. Very fine bottle, glad I have a couple more.

 

[robert ames]

thanks to all for the input and advice.

 

[VLM]

originally posted by Pavel Tchichikov:

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
2011 and 2012 are probably not too dissimilar

???!!!

Perhaps in that they can be approached in a similar time frame. Sure. That's where the similarities end. But even there I would argue - and this is personal and palate-specific - that while you *have* to drink 2011s sooner rather than later, you *can* (but don't have to) drink the 2012s early.

Almost all of my 2012s are gone and I'm planning on drinking my way through my 2011s in the next couple of years, before the 2010s, the on to 2013. Anything older than 2010 is Coudert or Desvignes, and who knows how long they last (or don't).

I realize I haven't had a 2013 Descombes Morgon VV in over a year and it was a magnum I took to a party and drank from cups, so I don't really know where the wine is right now, but I feel like it'll be a bit more backward than 2014.

2009 and older: be drinking
2010: can start, but drink 2011 and 2012 first
2011: bombs away
2012: start drinking
2013: drink after 2010 and maybe 2014
2014: hold for a little bit
2015: do you have any?
2016: not sure, really haven't tried many, just bought and cellared
2017: only Coudert so far, haven't tried.

What do other folks think?

 

[MLipton]

originally posted by VLM:

originally posted by Pavel Tchichikov:

originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
2011 and 2012 are probably not too dissimilar

???!!!

Perhaps in that they can be approached in a similar time frame. Sure. That's where the similarities end. But even there I would argue - and this is personal and palate-specific - that while you *have* to drink 2011s sooner rather than later, you *can* (but don't have to) drink the 2012s early.

Almost all of my 2012s are gone and I'm planning on drinking my way through my 2011s in the next couple of years, before the 2010s, the on to 2013. Anything older than 2010 is Coudert or Desvignes, and who knows how long they last (or don't).

I realize I haven't had a 2013 Descombes Morgon VV in over a year and it was a magnum I took to a party and drank from cups, so I don't really know where the wine is right now, but I feel like it'll be a bit more backward than 2014.

2009 and older: be drinking
2010: can start, but drink 2011 and 2012 first
2011: bombs away
2012: start drinking
2013: drink after 2010 and maybe 2014
2014: hold for a little bit
2015: do you have any?
2016: not sure, really haven't tried many, just bought and cellared
2017: only Coudert so far, haven't tried.

What do other folks think?

With the caveat that vintage generalizations are always fraught with complications, I generally agree with this advice. I'm just starting to broach my '09s and so far they are proving very ripe but otherwise ready to drink. Looking back through my recent-ish CT notes, I've been drinking mostly '11 and '12s and some '14s before they shut down (those that are shutting down).

Mark Lipton

 

[Jayson Cohen]

I’m definitely ready to drink my 1999s and 2000s, although I’d prefer to do that with folks Then we will see.

 

[kirk wallace]

originally posted by Pavel Tchichikov:
2009 JP Brun Moulin a VentThis seems like as good a place as any to report.

Pulled this last night because of a bizarre pairing challenge of baked green apples stuffed with ground beef, raisins, cinnamon, onions, chickpeas, etc.

Loved the wine. What's this 5-year rule the politburo goes on about? I missed the memo.

I wanted ripe, and I got ripe. Very healthy and balanced ripe. Reserved aromas of great promise, expressing more and more dusty stones with each pour. MaV vs 09 on the palate; MaV wins. Dense and muscular, layered; but tannins are ultimately rounded and ripe, if never soft. Great deep red cherry flavors. Over time, doing the you've been rewarded for drinking me slowly thing with sappiness and hints of exotic "red citrus" borne of low-ish acidity, never losing shape.

10-year rule subscribers, if any, may love this right now. There is not enough JPB in my cellar.

Must be The zeitgeist. I opened a mag of the JPB ‘09 Fleurie for friends last night. Not as dusty stoney or tannic as the MoV, of course. Blue fruits more than cherries. But a whole orchard on the nose. Excellent tautness and lovely earthiness and super silky in the mouth. I think there were 15 wines open with dinner, including Gruaud Larose ‘82 (solid, young, a wall of dense fruit and tanin) & ‘85 ( superb, I’m guessing in a prime drinking window if you still want fruit. So velvety and bright, but with all that Cabernet vegitalism.) , I kept coming back to the Brun.

 

[BJ]

To me it's a little harder to have a Rule in Beaujolais, as opposed to other regions, which we all know about. Generally speaking, I think of Beaujolais aging about twice as fast as Burgundies of similar quality. I think anything pre 05 is ready to drink, and many past their ideal. But as Lee and Jayson say, the best are still in their prime. I stupidly, STUPIDLY, unloaded a bunch of 05s and 06s during our move, and so I have little to draw from in those vintages, but some recents are too young. The 07s, my favorite vintage for years, is probably starting to slide over into tertiaries (?). 09, well, generally speaking for me too young...I am sitting on three cases of Tardive (a recent test bottle was too young). 10 was my first vintage without a cellar, but of course I regret missing the quality of the vintage - that seemed like one to go big on. I'm fairly clueless about vintages since then, except for 14 which I like and suggests a reprise of 07ishness, 15 which is a meh climate change vintage, and 16 seems a little 08ish.

Of course, all these generalizations are stupid.

 

[BJ]

Yeah and we all need to do a big cheer for JPB overdelivering kickass elegant complex wines for cheap. He rules! My personal fave is the CdB.

 

[Oswaldo Costa]

Again, even with generalizations, we have to distinguish the conventional from the semi-carbonic.

 

[Pavel Tchichikov]

originally posted by kirk wallace:
I kept coming back to the Brun.

JPB has some very fancy neighbors in town, who will tell you the Fleury is his best wine. I've only had the 05 recently, but the wine made it impossible to dispute the premise.

 

[Marc D]

I always love JPB Fleurie. I think it’s beautiful Fleurie and the most minerally of his crus.

We drank the 2010 Descombes Morgan VV last week. I thought it was awesome but MJ said it seemed overly sweet, not edgy enough. It was very fruit sweet like a phase some of the 2010 Burgundy were like early. But deep and old vine sappy. And lots of Morgon spice. But MJ only had one glass and declined a second pour.