Jay Miller
Jay Miller
2012 Meulenhoff Erdener Treppchen Riesling Spatlese "Alte Reben"
with
Franklin's BBQ Brisket
Thank you Goldbelly!
with
Franklin's BBQ Brisket
Thank you Goldbelly!
CWD: What did you drink last night (or whenever)?
- Thread starter Jayson Cohen
- Start date
Tristan Welles
Tristan Welles
post of the day
Jim Hanlon
Jim Hanlon
For the record, I'm a pilsner and lager person. For me, the first purpose of beer is to be refreshing. If I want complexity, I'll drink wine.
2019 Gonon Les Iles Feray. Continuing my recent streak of young wine. Damn, this is so good. Keith has a note on CT that the Feray has increased in complexity from its older days of being more glou glou. I didn't buy Feray back when the St. Joe itself hadn't exploded in price and was easily sourced, so I can't say, but that sure seems right. This wine is surely drinkable, but the depth of flavor and presence take it squarely out of glou glou. These guys are such good vignerons. If you have a couple or more, I encourage you to open one in the next couple months.
2019 Gonon Les Iles Feray. Continuing my recent streak of young wine. Damn, this is so good. Keith has a note on CT that the Feray has increased in complexity from its older days of being more glou glou. I didn't buy Feray back when the St. Joe itself hadn't exploded in price and was easily sourced, so I can't say, but that sure seems right. This wine is surely drinkable, but the depth of flavor and presence take it squarely out of glou glou. These guys are such good vignerons. If you have a couple or more, I encourage you to open one in the next couple months.
scottreiner
scott reiner
I tend to dislike IPAs, but the session versions and ones in the 5%-7% range can be interesting. There are also a number of either dry or wet hopped lagers and pilsners that are delicious.
The thing I have found incredibly enjoyable about the beer world is the sheer diversity of options, and I've only been trying Maine examples. It simply never ends! Saisons, barrel fermented ales, grisettes, fruit of all sorts, Helles Lagers, spontanious fermentations, mixed fermentations, farmhouse ales, sour ales, etc, etc, etc
I will be spending a lot more time in Maine going forward, and there seems to be some interest in the subject of beer with the comrades, so if anyone or a group is interested in spending a weekend in Portland this summer to eat and drink let me know. The city is a bounty of fabulous restaurants and breweries.
Some of what I've tried recently:
The thing I have found incredibly enjoyable about the beer world is the sheer diversity of options, and I've only been trying Maine examples. It simply never ends! Saisons, barrel fermented ales, grisettes, fruit of all sorts, Helles Lagers, spontanious fermentations, mixed fermentations, farmhouse ales, sour ales, etc, etc, etc
I will be spending a lot more time in Maine going forward, and there seems to be some interest in the subject of beer with the comrades, so if anyone or a group is interested in spending a weekend in Portland this summer to eat and drink let me know. The city is a bounty of fabulous restaurants and breweries.
Some of what I've tried recently:
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Well, regulars on this board know that calling something “spoof” is a short-hand way of saying “the taste/making of this offends my more-sophisticated-than-your’s taste.” I don’t drink a ton of beer but I like the bitter (but not too bitter) edge in a good IPA - appeals to my fondness for structure in my tipples (well, except for champagne
). I am liking RaR Nanticoke Nectar these days.
Jonathan Loesberg
Jonathan Loesberg
originally posted by maureen:
Well, regulars on this board know that calling something “spoof” is a short-hand way of saying “the taste/making of this offends my more-sophisticated-than-your’s taste.” I don’t drink a ton of beer but I like the bitter (but not too bitter) edge in a good IPA - appeals to my fondness for structure in my tipples (well, except for champagne
I am liking RaR Nanticoke Nectar these days.
I disagree with this. Some people spurn unspoofed wines for various reasons. Although various debates have failed to come up with a precise definition, the term spoof usually denotes a wine made with various levels of non-traditional and/or artificed practices to which the person using the term objects. It is true that when the term is applied to IPA, since beer doesn't have terroir involved, and routinely creates tastes by the manner in which it is made, the term is an analogy for over the top. Look, I like Chateauneuf du Pape on a bored that, in general terms, spurns the appellation. You need to own your tastes without getting judgmental about criticism of it. Other wise you end up, like Parker, labeling your enemies.
robert ames
robert ames
you can make beer without hops. you can't make it without malt--it is a malt beverage.
the more it becomes a beverage primarily flavoured by adjuncts, the more room there is for wanking. which is in the eye of the beholder.
the more it becomes a beverage primarily flavoured by adjuncts, the more room there is for wanking. which is in the eye of the beholder.
Jayson Cohen
Jayson Cohen
Do you know how hard it was to resist this soft ball?
robert ames
robert ames
of course.
don't hold back!
Salil Benegal
Salil Benegal
That wine is such a delight. I remember going through a ton of that and the 2009 on release.
Jeff Grossman
Jeff Grossman
There once was a young man from Ealing,
...
robert ames
robert ames
pour guy. . . .probably a fulham fan.
I would disagree. Nearly all beer has some hops in the recipe, even if not perceived by the taster. Stouts, Porters, Lambics, nearly every beer style other than White Claw and Bud Light will have hops. (there are beerish things like gruit, etc. that don't have hops)
You need fermentable sugars, not necessarily malt - corn sugar is also used in many of the large commercial beer products - ahem, Anheuser Busch.
robert ames
robert ames
but, in fact, you can make beer without hops. you yourself said "nearly all beer has some hops. . .". so, as you are saying, beer can exist without hops.
and yes, the great satans of the beer world do use corn. however, malt can be made from corn just the same way that it is made from barley. youtube can show you how. my guess is that is what miller, bud, et. al., do. they are malt beverages.
and yes, the great satans of the beer world do use corn. however, malt can be made from corn just the same way that it is made from barley. youtube can show you how. my guess is that is what miller, bud, et. al., do. they are malt beverages.
Steve Guattery
Steve Guattery
I remember once upon a time that Budweiser commercials switched from touting how it was made with barley to how it was made with rice.
Ken Schramm
Ken Schramm
Indeed, AB leans toward rice as its adjunct, and Miller toward corn. Most of them are not, however, actually malting the adjunct grains. If you want to talk about spoofing, they have been actively working to increase the amount of diastatic enzyme content of the barley they malt, to encourage it to convert higher and higher levels of (cheaper) adjunct. And most American macros have been using hops right at the flavor perception threshold or below for decades.
I love quality beers of all stripes. Lots of hops is fine, but I also love Lambics which have very low hops levels, as well as Weizens. I am about evenly split between lager and ale consumption. I love most pasionately beer that is honest, well-crafted and fresh. Loved the Mahr's beers when we could get them, but I love a Two Hearted pretty regularly, too. If you are a malt head, try Alpirsbacher Klosterbraü.
I've purchased a small system to begin piloting some fruited weizenbocks and stouts to create beers with many of the fruits we use in our meads. I have not brewe in the last 8 years or so, but I brewed a lot between 1988 and still have many friends in the homebrewing and craft beer community.
Tonight we had the 2005 Domaine Pavelot Pernand Vergelesses 1er En Caradeux. It was exceptionally satisfying. '05 was when they began including a portion whole cluster, which they have tinkered with and adjust based on the vineyard. Organic/Bio. Very giving and as much Pinot character as I can ask of a wine at this price point.
Jay Miller
Jay Miller
You were the one who introduced me to their Alte Rebens so thank you! I think it was at a Soul Flavors dinner?
Thanks Ken, fruited weizenbock sounds interesting. Maltier, denser berliner weisse? dunkleweiss? I'm always curious about fruit beers and meads too, it's interesting to see when the fruit is introduced and how it affects the eventual taste, similar to bittering vs. aroma hop additions.
Jayson Cohen
Jayson Cohen
I’ll weigh in on the beer discussion. I’m partial to Weisse beers and Lambics. A Hefeweizen would be my typical go-to if available out and about although I rarely buy beer to drink at home.
Back to wine, the last two nights had me in the M“con and Saar.
2019 Guillot-Broux M“con-Cruzille “Les Genièvrières”. The first night, I would characterize this wine as having separate strong elements that pulled themselves together with a day of air in the fridge. Fleshy up front, almost sweet, hiding vibrant acidity and a dense but playful core evident in the mouth. The winemaking has classic reduction, to steady the wine for the cellar, not a reduction bomb as is the rage further North. On day two the wine has evolved to a nose of light strawberry yogurt (not quite lactic) and spring flowers and an integrated palate. It’s really good. This was a test bottle, so I may go for a few for the cellar.
2020 Hofgut Falkenstein Niedermenniger Herrenberg Riesling Spätlese Feinherb “Palm” (AP 3). Falkenstein made 3 Herrenberg Feinherbs in 2020 and Palm is the second I’ve tried after Meyer Nepal (#11). Both come across more like Kabis than Spat Feinherbs, which is to my liking. Low alcohol at 8.5% helps keep 2020 Palm compelling and put together. Cool aromas of petrichor and pine forest and caraway meld with orange / tangerine / lime cream notes that are more disciplined and compact than in prior vintages. Compared to the past 4 vintages of Palm, 2020 is better integrated and more seamless at this age. This is a wonderful wine—as good as the 2020 Meyer Nepal, which I also loved. A million points here.
As an aside, I did something I’d never done to the Falkenstein, which left it none-the-worse-for-wear: I partially froze it while finishing up work last night, which I didn’t realize until I tried to pull the cork and almost pushed it in. A warning that corks do contract and loosen when frozen.
Tasting the Feinherb side by side with the last glass of the M“con, the M“con tasted a little like kid’s candy next to the Feinherb, however ironic that is given the relative amounts of RS.
Back to wine, the last two nights had me in the M“con and Saar.
2019 Guillot-Broux M“con-Cruzille “Les Genièvrières”. The first night, I would characterize this wine as having separate strong elements that pulled themselves together with a day of air in the fridge. Fleshy up front, almost sweet, hiding vibrant acidity and a dense but playful core evident in the mouth. The winemaking has classic reduction, to steady the wine for the cellar, not a reduction bomb as is the rage further North. On day two the wine has evolved to a nose of light strawberry yogurt (not quite lactic) and spring flowers and an integrated palate. It’s really good. This was a test bottle, so I may go for a few for the cellar.
Tasting the Feinherb side by side with the last glass of the M“con, the M“con tasted a little like kid’s candy next to the Feinherb, however ironic that is given the relative amounts of RS.