Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
It’s really amazing how easily one can be misunderstood. Assuming it’s not ill will on your part, it must be my faulty command of the English language.
CWD: What did you drink last night (or whenever)?
- Thread starter Jayson Cohen
- Start date
It’s really amazing how easily one can be misunderstood. Assuming it’s not ill will on your part, it must be my faulty command of the English language.
Jonathan Loesberg
Jonathan Loesberg
I think you take Jayson to be saying that you would rather drink pet nat than any Champagne at all, which, of course, you, explicitly did not say. But, I think, Jayson was complaining that you would rather drink pet nat than any of the Champagnes on the list that Marc reproduced, which you did seem to say, and which you should hold if you reject MLF on principle as an intervention, except when caused by naturally cold cellars. What Jayson needs to understand is that you hold this principle in the way Kant holds a moral precept, as commanding respect even when it thwarts your own interest, in this case that the wine taste good. One could argue that this form of adherence is misplaced, but I would agree that it is not pedantic bullshit. I do think your attempt to exculpate MLF of the effects one usually finds it has and of endorsing it for having effect one usually takes as the point of blocking MLF less persuasive.
Oswaldo Costa
Oswaldo Costa
I didn’t understand the last sentence, but the rest is either correct or reasonable.
Jayson Cohen
Jayson Cohen
Oh no. I literally was just deleting that post to replace it with one from someone who is actually human and civil. I was more than a little tipsy when I wrote that in the wee hours last night and it’s my bad. Truly very sorry.
I do hate per nat though. That’s a personal thing. (Pavel will tell me I’m wrong and blind with something good now, I’m sure.) And I really never could understand non-interventionalist philosophy taken to the level of thinking that blocking malo, temperature control, and sulfur additions are bad things and to be avoided. But we’ve had that conversation before.
Salil Benegal
Salil Benegal
1992 Rene Rostaing Côte-Rôtie Cuvée Classique was a revelation the other night. I've had more misses than hits from Rostaing and often found them a bit oaky. But that was gorgeous, tons of green and black olives, smoky and meaty and herbal notes, and gentle red fruit. Everything I could expect from an old school N Rhone, just that I didn't expect any of that from that bottle.
A 2012 Domaine Joël Champet Côte-Rôtie La Viallière was also excellent, slightly overshadowed that evening by the Rostaing, but showing plenty of savoury olive/smoky/herbal elements around a more youthful red fruited core. Still quite young (yes, yes, I know it violates the Rule of 15) with quite a bit of tannic grip, but delicious.
A 2012 Domaine Joël Champet Côte-Rôtie La Viallière was also excellent, slightly overshadowed that evening by the Rostaing, but showing plenty of savoury olive/smoky/herbal elements around a more youthful red fruited core. Still quite young (yes, yes, I know it violates the Rule of 15) with quite a bit of tannic grip, but delicious.
Zachary Ross
Zachary Ross
I hate petnat too and am drinking 2020 Domaine Richard Rottiers Moulin-à-Vent Dernier Souffle. This is not something I hate and would gladly drink this anytime, anywhere, even on root days. This is really fantastic Beaujolais, fleshy and richly fruited but very well defined, with chewy red fruit and a strong savory finish. Outstanding value at about $20, delivered.
Mark Anisman
Mark Anisman
2012 Weiser-Künstler Enkircher Ellergrub Riesling Große Eule
I approach dry Mosel wines with a healthy degree of trepidation as often too acidic for my/our taste. No reason for that emotion here!
Beautifully balanced in fruit / mineral / acidity. light mouth feel and clearly etched flavors come thru strong. A sensation akin to watching Barry Sanders run.
Truly a brilliant wine....
I approach dry Mosel wines with a healthy degree of trepidation as often too acidic for my/our taste. No reason for that emotion here!
Beautifully balanced in fruit / mineral / acidity. light mouth feel and clearly etched flavors come thru strong. A sensation akin to watching Barry Sanders run.
Truly a brilliant wine....
Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
brilliant 2012s from them to this day, trocken and feinherb, although i never owned this wine
Steve Edmunds
Steve Edmunds
how old is Barry Sanders, now? Does he still run? Is he younger, or older than I am? I forget...
Jayson Cohen
Jayson Cohen
He’s 55. I’m sure he runs late on occasion. Don’t we all.
But seriously he was the best, turning being a running back almost into an art form if you give some license, and extremely humble considering how highly regarded he was and is. As a Lions fan, I couldn’t blame him for stepping away at his prime still, however hard that was as a fan. (Yes, I admit I am a football fan. Both kinds.)
Steve Edmunds
Steve Edmunds
thanks, Jayson; think I saw him once or twice, and knew he was really good; it was just a hard association around which to wrap this old brain.
Pavel Tchichikov
Pavel Tchichikov
no idea what y'all are talking about here.
just because much of what's posing as pet nat looks and tastes like bad hefeweizen does not preclude occasional brilliance.
i must have consumed a couple of cases of patrice colin's perles grises (all vendomois pineau d'aunis) over the past three years, and a '17 pinon grolleau/cot last week was just superb
just because much of what's posing as pet nat looks and tastes like bad hefeweizen does not preclude occasional brilliance.
i must have consumed a couple of cases of patrice colin's perles grises (all vendomois pineau d'aunis) over the past three years, and a '17 pinon grolleau/cot last week was just superb
Zachary Ross
Zachary Ross
Pfifferling does a fine job with petnat, Mosse too, etc. - but as a class petnat is minefield to say the least, and on your basic NYC “natural wine” list, an easy pass.
Mark Anisman
Mark Anisman
2019 Pierre Gonon Ardèche Les Iles Feray
ebullient. beautiful syrah fruit goodness, smoothly conducting itself thru the midpalate and the solid core drives to a shortish finish (no points to be deducted). some structure left to soften but not a distraction. well balanced wine marked by the vibrant and happy fruit while not trying to wow you with complexity (but not a simple wine by any means).
overall impression : a feeling akin to a good friend popping at your doorstep & surprising you with a visit.
or perhaps the sensation you have as a season ticketed Lions Fan and watching Barry Sanders run every which way.
ebullient. beautiful syrah fruit goodness, smoothly conducting itself thru the midpalate and the solid core drives to a shortish finish (no points to be deducted). some structure left to soften but not a distraction. well balanced wine marked by the vibrant and happy fruit while not trying to wow you with complexity (but not a simple wine by any means).
overall impression : a feeling akin to a good friend popping at your doorstep & surprising you with a visit.
or perhaps the sensation you have as a season ticketed Lions Fan and watching Barry Sanders run every which way.
Jayson Cohen
Jayson Cohen
Mark, I loved Barry, but 24 years on now and several mentions lately, is he your fetish? Or has the recent documentary reignited an old passion? Or a little of both?
Mark Anisman
Mark Anisman
neither.
have not watched the documentary and i doubt i will.
i was at the 9er / Lions game at Candlestick during Sander's last season. on a sweep right at full speed (coming towards us), he dead stopped and fluidly went back to his left. it was an uncanny fluid. no sense of stopping and starting. i still can not imagine a person doing what he did. a moment of magic enshrined by multiple neurons. still can see several 9ers flying to the right of Sanders where his ghost now lived.
but his athletic feets do at times apply to amazement brought on by wines and other things of grace & beauty.
further purple prose will be herewith referenced to music and/or majesties.
have not watched the documentary and i doubt i will.
i was at the 9er / Lions game at Candlestick during Sander's last season. on a sweep right at full speed (coming towards us), he dead stopped and fluidly went back to his left. it was an uncanny fluid. no sense of stopping and starting. i still can not imagine a person doing what he did. a moment of magic enshrined by multiple neurons. still can see several 9ers flying to the right of Sanders where his ghost now lived.
but his athletic feets do at times apply to amazement brought on by wines and other things of grace & beauty.
further purple prose will be herewith referenced to music and/or majesties.
Steve Edmunds
Steve Edmunds
dude, you're doing some pretty athletically dazzling verbalizing there, and it's making my head swivel. Nice work!
Jayson Cohen
Jayson Cohen
14, 5, 4, 2:
Jayson Cohen
Jayson Cohen
I picked a few that I imagined epitomized Mark’s description of crazy reverses of direction. Honestly I watched a lot of Lions games during Barry’s career, and he did crazy reverse direction moves that no one else I have seen has ever been able to do all the time and almost by rote.