Syrahfest

originally posted by VLM:
originally posted by MarkS:
Ferraton, Hermitage, 'les Miaux', 1998
Whatever happened to these vignerons? I never see them around anymore. Translucent dried maroon red color. Cherry straw and iron on the nose. Rusty iron, beet skin, sour cherry-redcurrant juice, with noticeable tannins remaining. This is probably toward peak now, having the middle-aged spirit of fighting a vision of future death, but balancing the tension between smooth fruit and loss of such. In a good spot. B+
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Bought by Chapoutier or Terlato or some such and used mainly as a negiociant arm.

I've had some great bottles of Ferraton in the past, too bad.
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Here is a portion is John Livingstone-Learmonth's capsule description of the domain, used fairly of course.

"Since 2006 this domaine has been wholly owned by Chapoutier, although the vinification is in separet premises. It is a domaine that worked in conjunction with Chapoutier since 1998, half of the venture selling single vineyard wines, half selling merchant wines. The Ferraton family has vineyards at Hermitage on the easterly sites like Diognires, but also prime 1960s Syrah on Le Mal. The domaine vineyards are mainly cultivated biodynamically. Winemaking methods are generally modern, with overt oak use."
 
I think that most of these small producers don't put the wine into blending tanks and that trying for any sort of consensus around barrique aged wines in particular is a fairly useless exercise as they are often bottled barrel by barrel.

Parker et al don't want to talk about this because it makes their decisive/declarative notes and scoring meaningless.

Sort of makes wine discussion in general pretty worthless, I guess, as common reference points are missing.

FWIW, Tardieu is the winemaker for TL wines, not Laurent. Pretty similar methods tho.
 
originally posted by Brad L i l j e q u i s t:
Parker et al don't want to talk about this because it makes their decisive/declarative notes and scoring meaningless.
.
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After all, why let a fussy detail like that ruin the party.
 
I don't know Mark but I think it's a fair assumption he has a good palate. The wine he described is nothing like the wine I had Friday night. My wine was vibrant and has years left in it. Applying Ockham's Razor, or some form of it, the deduction I make is that there's problems with the bottle he had.
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Or perhaps your taste is fucked up? Mark has good palate, bottles sound different, ergo Steve has a shit palate. Same razor, different cut.
 
As long as we're quoting JLL, here's what he has to say about Tardieu-Laurent:

"LVT 2006 wh 2007 r The Kings of new oak. Michel Tardieu is the Rhne connection with his Burgundian partner Dominique Laurent. They are merchants who raise wine in their southern Rhne cellars at Lourmarin in the Lubron. They always use excellent sources - old vines, good growers, prime sites. The cut back on new oak since 2003 is very welcome - it is now 15, not 24 months, with the remaining 9 months in 1-2 year casks. Their Cornas has always been my favourite - it comes in a more savoury style than some, but the richness is genuine and prolonged. The Hermitage is also very consistent in red and white. These are expensive wines - not surprising after the oak has been paid for! In the south, the Gigondas (2004 notably) and the Ctes du Rhne Guy Louis red are very good - both value for money."

Does this say more about T-L or JLL?
 
JLL might be accused of being a bit broad minded.

I find, though, that you have to read what he doesn't say on a subject along with what he does say. That description of TL (which squares with my limited experience) tells me what I need to know.
 
originally posted by SFJoe:
JLL might be accused of being a bit broad minded.

I find, though, that you have to read what he doesn't say on a subject along with what he does say. That description of TL (which squares with my limited experience) tells me what I need to know.
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Isn't this just a reprise of our discussion of JLL and Guigal a few years ago? Yes, JLL seems to strive for evenhanded treatment of the various styles of winemaking, even though his preferences are made very clear to even the casual reader (STGT, after all) and his praise of favored winemakers is far from low key.

Mark Lipton
 
originally posted by Yixin:
I don't know Mark but I think it's a fair assumption he has a good palate. The wine he described is nothing like the wine I had Friday night. My wine was vibrant and has years left in it. Applying Ockham's Razor, or some form of it, the deduction I make is that there's problems with the bottle he had.
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Or perhaps your taste is fucked up? Mark has good palate, bottles sound different, ergo Steve has a shit palate. Same razor, different cut.
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Perhaps Yixin is fucked up? Because Yixin probably can't tell the difference between a fading wine and one with years left and assumes others can't either?
 
i firmly believe in bottle variation, barrel variation, shipping/storage condition variation, palate variation, lunar cycles and mood rings.
 
originally posted by SFJoe:
originally posted by Brad L i l j e q u i s t:
As we've said before, he's very discreet, in a nice English way.
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Yah, no way he'd fit in around here.
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Just what are you trying to say, arseclown? [insert proper emoticon here]

Mark Lipton
 
originally posted by SteveTimko:
originally posted by Yixin:
I don't know Mark but I think it's a fair assumption he has a good palate. The wine he described is nothing like the wine I had Friday night. My wine was vibrant and has years left in it. Applying Ockham's Razor, or some form of it, the deduction I make is that there's problems with the bottle he had.
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Or perhaps your taste is fucked up? Mark has good palate, bottles sound different, ergo Steve has a shit palate. Same razor, different cut.
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Perhaps Yixin is fucked up? Because Yixin probably can't tell the difference between a fading wine and one with years left and assumes others can't either?
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Yes, of course.
 
I was cleaning out the cellar and saw a bottle of 99 TL Crozes Coteaux kicking around and I was curious, given this (I must say unusually nasty) thread.

A lot less oak than I expected. Still, certainly modern, even given the plush vintage. Blind I might have guessed Australian, but a more "traditional" Aussie producer. Probably at the far end of the spectrum of what we will drink. It was fine with very slow dry roasted pork ribs from Lopez Island. I opened this after opening absolutely horrifying 03 Vatican CNP (prunes) and 03 Puygueraud Cali Cab (oaky uck) - both of which went back in the fridge for delivery to our non-wine friend who drinks such things...

The cellar purge continues and I am freeing us of anything that doesn't sound good.
 
... Still, certainly modern, even given the plush vintage. Blind I might have guessed Australian...
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uh, I wouldn't exactly call this vindication. Doesn't sound like anything to gloat about to me.
 
Let's try to mend some fences, heal some wounds. Mark, VLM, Yixin, let's all father round here and hold hands. Joe and Rahsaan, you too. Rahsaan you have a beautiful bass voice.
I'll start.

Kum bay ya, my Looorrrd, kum bay yaaa!
Kum bay ya, my Looorrrd, kum bay yaaa!
Kum bay ya, my Lord, kum bay yaa!
O Lord, kum bay ya!

Okay, who's next?
Anyone else, if your spirit moves you, feel free to join in.
 
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