Gueuze and Kriek

S

Saina Nieminen

Saina Nieminen
3 Fonteinen Oude Gueuze
I love Cantillon, but until now, I haven't seen the other examples of Gueuze that aren't like soda-pop (we've just had super sweet ones available), but now a bar here got Drie Fonteinen's Oude Gueuze which I remember being described as something I should enjoy.

And I did enjoy it. Peace dude! Like ... you know ... whoah! Spliffing stuff! Smells like a Pot of Tea! It smells of Grass. This drink channels the universal, transcendental light, man! Never having tasted cannabis products I can't say if the aromas follow on the palate, but I can say that it is dry, crisp, delightful and moreish, but in no way severely acidic like Cantillon. A friendly style of Gueuze, but still very nice.

Lindemans Cuve Ren
I guess even such a commercialized, crappy producer as Lindemans must make the occasional good beer. This is a rare beer, one where Lindemans' undoubtedly talented brewers can actually make beer instead of soft-drinks. Supremely cherried scent, even more so than in Cantillon's Lou Pepe; dry, crisp, moreish, delightfully sour. From what I have sampled, I really couldn't believe Lindemans could make something so good. But I would still rather have Krieks from Cantillon or, recently, De Ranke whose Kriek has IMO become better and better with every batch.
 
These are pretty top flight examples of Gueuze, the 3 Fronteinen in particular. He lost a lot of his barrel stock to overheating/failed refrigeration, so the beer is definitely hard to get a hold of currently. He also makes a natural Kreik.

If you liked these, and you can get it, check out Boone. They have natural fruit flavored lambics/gueuzes that are amazing. They're not syrupy like the Lindeman's. Brasserie Vapeur's Saison de Pipaix is probably one of the strangest things I've ever imbibed, and definitely worth pursuing as well. There's a batch going around the States that was bottled in '95 and still kicking, albeit with wild bottle variation. Cantillion is also really worth checking out, if you've only had the Lou Pepe. Especially check out their beer co-fermented with muscat grapes. They do another with Merlot that I haven't had, but I assume it's great.

My top vote for a beer that will make any wine geek believe is sours is De Dolle's Oudbeir Reserva. It's vintage dated, aged in used Bordeaux barrels and at nearly 14% alcohol and raging acidity, it's the closest to wine I've ever had that's made out of grain. Really superb, whether comparing to wine or relative to other sour beers.
 
Possibly due to raging acidity, probably also due to questionable provenance, I haven't been able to enjoy any of the Cantillons I've tried from local sources. The 3 Fonteinen sounds more like in my wheelhouse...thanks for the notes.

I'll second Morgan on the vintage Boone Framboise. That is a great food lambic. Went thru a lot of 2004's last year.
 
Morgan, I can't believe I forgot it, but we did have Boon's (not Boone's) Oude Gueuze available here for quite some time. Sadly it was massively overpriced at Alko, so I didn't drink huge amounts of it (it only cost 0,50 more to go to a good pub and get Cantillon, which I prefer). But the Boon was really very good. I didn't like the Kriek from them - that was just sweet, soda-pop. I'll have to see if their other Lambics are available (it wasn't the Oude Kriek, but the basic one that was available - I'm sure the older ones will be more interesting).

Cantillon is very familiar to me, because I used to run the bookshop with a chap who also imported some beers, including Cantillon, to Finland. So I've tasted almost all fruit sours they've made, including much of the rare stuff made specifically for particular bars. But I thought the Vigneronne was made from Chardonnay sourced in Burgundy, not Muscat. I think they did make one beer with Muscat grapes for a bar in Stockholm called Akkurat. Or did I get my grapes mixed up now? As great as these beers are, I always find myself going back to their Gueuze, basic Kriek and the Grand Cru Bruocsella (unmixed lambic).

Joel, A plate of cheese or something else fatty, and I don't mind the raging acidity of Cantillon at all.
 
Otto,

I think you hit the nail on the head with your description of the Drie Fonteinen. I find it powerfully dry, but with nowhere near the acidity of Cantillon. I'm a fierce traditionalist when it comes to lambic, and cringe at the mere thought of the Lindeman's fruit lambics, but cannot find anything bad to say about the Cuvee Renee gueuze. I've yet to have the Cuvee Rene kriek, which I'm assuming you're talking about, but my experience with the gueuze tells me it should be good.

I just might have to put a bottle of Drie Foneinen oude gueuze in the refrigerator, this thread has created a lambic craving that won't disappear.

Cheers!

Kevin
 
originally posted by Morgan Harris:
The sour beersThese are pretty top flight examples of Gueuze, the 3 Fronteinen in particular. He lost a lot of his barrel stock to overheating/failed refrigeration, so the beer is definitely hard to get a hold of currently. He also makes a natural Kreik.
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Armand did lose a lot to overheating, though I believe it was distilled into some sort of eau du vie of gueuze. Also, (and mostly because of the loss and the costs incurred) he will no longer be brewing his own lambics for blending, but will have Frank Boon making some for him according to his original recipe. I've also heard production will be down for a while as the new system comes on line.
 
Pricing is very strange for these in the NYC market. The Drei in 750 is about $20 retail (when, if ever, you can find it), but the batch of 375s I've seen in restaurants are in the 30-40 range.

In general, they're so misunderstood, and are not really found on most beer lists, even in beer bars. If you want to try some beers that give you faith in American Sours, check out any of the Jolly Pumpkin beers, in particular the Blanca de Calabaza, Oro de Calabaza, or La Roja. They're out of Michigan and are naturally fermented, but not blended/aged. Apparently finding locations with the right conditions for creating wild yeast beers has been difficult in the states. Pricing in NYC is really weird. I've seen Blanca at $32 dollars and I've seen it at $14 in 750ml.

It's weird. The beer geeks are say, "Where are the hops?" and the wine people say, "Well, it's not wine." And so I'm left sitting there, drinking my naturally fermented Belgian beverages all alone, tears of loneliness slipping into my tart brew.

Also, can any of you science people talk to why exactly they develop such acidity, which strains enzymes/yeasts do this? I guess what's the chemical process that generates the acid?
 
originally posted by Morgan Harris:
I'm so lonely...Pricing is very strange for these in the NYC market. The Drei in 750 is about $20 retail (when, if ever, you can find it), but the batch of 375s I've seen in restaurants are in the 30-40 range.

In general, they're so misunderstood, and are not really found on most beer lists, even in beer bars. If you want to try some beers that give you faith in American Sours, check out any of the Jolly Pumpkin beers, in particular the Blanca de Calabaza, Oro de Calabaza, or La Roja. They're out of Michigan and are naturally fermented, but not blended/aged. Apparently finding locations with the right conditions for creating wild yeast beers has been difficult in the states. Pricing in NYC is really weird. I've seen Blanca at $32 dollars and I've seen it at $14 in 750ml.

It's weird. The beer geeks are say, "Where are the hops?" and the wine people say, "Well, it's not wine." And so I'm left sitting there, drinking my naturally fermented Belgian beverages all alone, tears of loneliness slipping into my tart brew.

Also, can any of you science people talk to why exactly they develop such acidity, which strains enzymes/yeasts do this? I guess what's the chemical process that generates the acid?
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Your not so alone. I love the Jolly Pumpkin beers. I have some friends who were really into wine that have gone whole hog into beer and especially sour beers. They've been kind enough to invite me to a couple of their tasting get togethers. Most have been American sours, but there have been a few Belgians thrown in. My favorite of the American sours besides Jolly Pumpkin have been the ones from Russian River Brewing Co. It's amazing how limited and expensive some of these beers go for. They opened one that is going for over a hundred bucks a bottle (the Isabelle Proximus). It was good, but not a hundred dollars good (I don't think they guys I know paid that much for them anyways). Another MI sour beer I had recently that you should keep an eye for is the Whaleback White from the Leelanau Breweing Co. If you ever find yourself in Detroit, go to Slows where they have it for $9 in a 750.
 
Kevin, yes, I was talking of the Cuve Ren Kriek. I haven't tried the Gueuze of that. But does the 3 Fonteinen usually smell so strongly of cannabis? I thought that was a bit weird. Since you also are a fierce traditionalist when it comes to sours, do you have anyone else to add on this list of who makes real sours: Cantillon, Boon, 3 Fonteinen, De Ranke. Anyone else?

Morgan, I have never had a scientist explain the sharpness, but my ex-colleague was of the opinion that it is caused Brettanomyces. But though he has excellent taste in beers, he is rather shaky when it comes to the technical side. I, too, would be very interested to hear if anyone knows for sure.

I'm surprised that the beer geeks there don't appreciate these so much. Finland may be a backwater for all things alcoholic (except if quantity imbibed per capita is something worth noting), but Lambics and Gueuze are very much appreciated by the geeks.
 
The majority of the acid in lambic is produced by pediococcus. Some is produced by lactobacillus strains, but papers I've read suggest there's a fairly narrow pH window where lacto strains efficiently produce lactic acid. The multitude of saccharomyces strains in conjunction with the multiple brett strains, which can ferment body maintining dextrins are responsible for the powerful dryness.

Otto, as for other recommendations, De Ranke, as much as I like the beers, are a blend of purchased lambic. Mainly Girardin, if I recall correctly, with De Ranke brewed beer, plus cherries in the case of the Kriek. I would definitely recommend Girardin in addition to those you name, and there are a couple others I'd look out for. 1, produced in minute and sporadic quantities is Belle Vue Seleccion Lambic, I hear rumors of stashes in various places in Belgium, but the single bottle I sampled was excellent, even though the rest of their line is between barely tolerable and abhorrent. The other is a blender, who purchases lambic from Boon, Girardin and others, called De Cam. They make both gueuze and kriek, possible others, but their stuff is worth looking out for.

Lars, I'm a big, big, big, Jolly Pumpkin fan and I'd defintely put their Bam Biere on my very short list of desert island beers. They actually make the Leelanau white of which you speak as well. And you're also barking up the right tree when you talk of Russian River brewing in Santa Rosa. They do two things exceedingly well--creative wild sour beers, and crazily hopped american style things. And Vinnie the brewer/founder is a heck of a guy.

Cheers,

Kevin
 
originally posted by Joel Stewart:
Sounds like I might find the RRB brews on my next trip to the Pac NW. Good to know..thanks.
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Their Damnation, which I really enjoy, is neither sour nor one of their excellent hoppy beers. It's a Duvel-style Belgian golden strong. It's probably their beer with the greatest shelf presence. Are you going to Seattle? If so, Brouwer's Cafe should have a few of their sours on the bottle list, if you're on the hunt.

Cheers,

Kevin
 
Will check out BC in Seattle, thanks Kevin. My folks are south in Olympia, but the Top Foods there has a beer section that's been exploding with domestic and euro lambics, etc in the last year....so I wouldn't be surprised to find some RRB there. (Found some killer Deustchland Rauch bier last time I was there.)
 
I love real lambic. Even judged the AHA final round competition years ago in that style. I have some gong in a keg downstairs. Can't buy it where I live. None. Sometimes there is kool-aid stuff (Mort Subite) but that's it.
 
Oswaldo, while I'm sure Jeff appreciates the traditional welcome, he predates you by probably 10 or 15 years of online wine forum geekery.
 
originally posted by Thor:
Oswaldo, while I'm sure Jeff appreciates the traditional welcome, he predates you by probably 10 or 15 years of online wine forum geekery.
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I'll forgive him, just because I'm, well, you know.... Canadian.
 
originally posted by Oswaldo Costa:
I see, grandfather rights.
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Just been in more lurker mode. Every time I get more involved on here, I piss away too much time reading about wines (and beers) I can't buy where I live. Costs me mega bucks in airfare, it does.
 
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