Jancis Robinson on goings-on in the northern Rhône

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originally posted by Brézème:
...

I deeply believe that culture is the best protection against globalization.
For wine or anything else.

This makes me think about Pollan's book again: substitute 'agricultural industrialization' for 'globalization.'

I'm not finding evidence that anyone imports Gentaz into the U.S. Youngest vintage appearing in Cellar Tracker is 1991.
 
originally posted by Zachary Ross:
Kermit imported Gentaz at one point, is that right?
Correct. Gentaz's last year was 1993. After that, his nephew René Rostaing took over the vines and made wine from them. (There was a brief interlude where Gentaz's son-in-law was to take over, but that is too sad a story to repeat here.)
 
originally posted by VS:
Is there anywhere where it isn't? :-)

Some interesting results are obtained that way lately in Spain with grapes that are not wildly aromatic - and the Madrid albillo (one of two, unrelated albillos in Spain) is a case in point. There's also a crazy Scottish guy making wine outside Madrid in quasi-orange fashion who gets interesting results out of the normally dull airén.

I'm guessing one could make anything 'interesting' if it was orange, but then, it loses it's tipicite, doesn't it? Becoming like another 'made' wine, where production defines the product.
 
originally posted by MarkS:
originally posted by VS:
Is there anywhere where it isn't? :-)

Some interesting results are obtained that way lately in Spain with grapes that are not wildly aromatic - and the Madrid albillo (one of two, unrelated albillos in Spain) is a case in point. There's also a crazy Scottish guy making wine outside Madrid in quasi-orange fashion who gets interesting results out of the normally dull airén.

I'm guessing one could make anything 'interesting' if it was orange, but then, it loses it's tipicite, doesn't it? Becoming like another 'made' wine, where production defines the product.

Yeah, except it doesn't, does it?

The differences from one Orange to another can be extreme.

You may as well say that "making" a wine red means it loses its typicite.
 
originally posted by MarkS:
I'm guessing one could make anything 'interesting' if it was orange, but then, it loses it's tipicite, doesn't it? Becoming like another 'made' wine, where production defines the product.

Forgive me if I misinterpet, but you say that like its a bad thing.

Isn't there room for all types of 'products' in this realm?
Isn't 'interesting' something to be strived for?
Aren't you defining 'tipicite' in a narrow sense (a sense that comports only with your thoughts on what it means)?
'Production defines product' also seems to be a little myopic - or at least, leaves no room for a range in such a description.
Not that you don't have that right - but it seems a bit conservative for a man who tastes the variety that you do.
(Of course, I admit my self-interest in the answers to these questions.)

It seems to me that these comments rather define a single point on the sliding scale that is wine making/producing and sound a lot like some of these "only natural wines" arguments I see in blogs, etc.
Perspective is lost in favor of, IMO, a virtually unattainable standard. And to what end?
Best, Jim
 
originally posted by VS:
Well, we had the 2001 together the other night, Ignacio. If that's dark side, gimme dark side...

I implied they had gone to a darker side, not to the dark side. Their wines are somehow more polished and less sauvage than in the 90s...though they are still good
 
originally posted by Brézème:
I deeply believe that culture is the best protection against globalization.
For wine or anything else.

It may be the best protection, but if it were a reliable one, globalization wouldn't be a problem since its largest threat is precisely to local culture.
 
originally posted by Claude Kolm:
Mark -- A big difference is the much greater presence of old vines in Cornas than in Côte-Rôtie. And then there's the vegetal material. For a long time in the 1970s-1980s, maybe even 1990s, people at Côte-Rôtie were planting with a Syrah clone that came from the Southern Rhône and not from the indigenous plants. And then, too, there is the great expansion onto the plain above the Côtes (although Cornas is now having its own issues, too, with expansion). Finally, there were a lot more oldtimers in Cornas and they passed a lot on to the younger generation (at least that part that was willing to follow them): in the 1970s and first 7 years or so of the 1980s, the only new vigneron to take over in Cornas was Robert Michel; all the rest of the young people left for non-wine jobs.

Are you familiar with Levet's wines? They come from Ton-ton Chambeyron (not the Chambeyron who today operates in Côte-Rôtie). Ton-ton was a legend and no less than Marcel Guigal once told me that Chambeyron was the best in Côte-Rôtie in the 1940s, 1950s and 1960s when I asked about him. Mme. Levet is Chambeyron's daughter and inherited his vines and still does everything very traditionally; her daughter has been taking over -- very unusual to find a female producer in the Northern Rhône.

Even those who have old vines often dilute them with new vine plantings. When Kermit Lynch was representing Rostaing and Rostaing had inherited Gentaz's vines, Kermit tried to get Rostaing to make a cuvée Gentaz. Rostaing did keep the wine separate in cask for a few years and I tasted it there and was superb. But Rostaing blended it back into the other wines.

I'm sure Brézème can add a lot more here.

Thanks Claude. Old vines. OK. I am familiar with Levet, good wines...solid. Special? Not really.

I think it's a combination of style and perhaps old vines and probably many other factors, in the vineyard, parcel locations, etc. I did certainly notice the difference in the cellar at Allemand and Clape, the Verset barrels were special.

What we need is a producer in Cote Rotie that makes wines in the style of Gentaz or Verset with decently old vines...

...Too bad that Levet or something else didn't get the Gentaz vines.
 
originally posted by Claude Kolm:
originally posted by Zachary Ross:
Kermit imported Gentaz at one point, is that right?
Correct. Gentaz's last year was 1993. After that, his nephew René Rostaing took over the vines and made wine from them. (There was a brief interlude where Gentaz's son-in-law was to take over, but that is too sad a story to repeat here.)

We can hope the style changes at Rostaing and they separate the vines. :)
 
Claude - thank you. It was through you that I drank my first Gentaz, and once in a while you can still find bottles forgotten in some cellars. Unlike others, I'm not greedy - I just want the old-style Jamet, Yapp-approved Jasmin, and some Pierre Barge. And Juge while we're at it.
 
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