Latest Marcassin mailer
- Thread starter Jay Miller
- Start date
Steven Spielmann
Steven Spielmann
I'd settle for a Beaune 1er faculty position. My credit cards are running out of room.
Lou Kessler
Lou Kessler
Who would not love the Martinelli chards and pinots, they were bigger than big and larger than life. OOH WOW!
Larry Stein
Larry Stein
Went once to their tasting room about 10 years ago. The attitude that wafted from the staff was "Our shit doesn't stink". It sure did smell a lot like new oak and VA.
I think I took a bottle of that to the one jeebus at minetta tavern I attended just to torment the attendees. It was truly foul. I got shamed into buying something when I stopped at the tasting room on my way to the applewood inn and I couldn't bear to buy what I'd actually tasted so I bought this with the hope that it was less awful than what I'd tried.
It wasn't. Maybe even worse.
Jay Miller
Jay Miller
I had to leave room between it and the Aubert which was far, far worse.
BTW - the "Other California" refers to the format of the tasting - there was one CA pinot other than Copain in each flight.
Ian Fitzsimmons
Ian Fitzsimmons
With wars in the middle east, political suppression in Syria and Burma, famine impending in Somalia, and the U.S. credit rating downgraded, don't you people have anything better to do than make Marcassin your devil?
Jay Miller
Jay Miller
I'll do you the favor of assuming sarcasm here. If not, I'd point out that this is a wine board and therefore people talk about wine related things here.
One time maybe 9-10 years ago, I was at a Bay Area shop that offers thematic flights daily. It's a well respected shop in an affluent town. The flight that day was higher end CA pinot noirs. There was a current release Marcassin included. It was the only time I've tried one.
It was somewhat but not seriously corked, certainly off and not good. It was also, I think, over double the price of any of the other not cheap wines. The interesting thing to me was that no one there except me was willing to declare the wine as corked and a bad bottle. There were guarded postponements of judgement, refusals to commit, and other mumbled excuses. I was amazed. Reverence seemed to be trumping taste sense. It was weird.
It was somewhat but not seriously corked, certainly off and not good. It was also, I think, over double the price of any of the other not cheap wines. The interesting thing to me was that no one there except me was willing to declare the wine as corked and a bad bottle. There were guarded postponements of judgement, refusals to commit, and other mumbled excuses. I was amazed. Reverence seemed to be trumping taste sense. It was weird.
Jeff Grossman
Jeff Grossman
Ah, for those nostalgic days of painting horns and a black goatee on Chapoutier, Sokol Blosser, and Tollot-Beaut.
Matt Latuchie
Matt Latuchie
for those interested, here's Parker's response to the Marcassin mailer over on the Parker board,
"I have known both John and Helen for over 20 years....intellectually, both are brilliant, and as well informed about viticulture in all its ramifications as anyone I have met with the possible exceptions of David Abreu,the Smiths at Saxum, and Manfred Krankl. They are also very reclusive, opinionated,and suffer no fools, but I have never seen them throw out outrageous ideas or shoot from the hip...their statements come from carefully considered and deep knowledge and research...they don't need to ridicule Burgundy's viticulture or the DRC to sell one bottle of their wine...they believe certain aspects of Burgundy's pruning, hedging, and trellising systems could be improved(this is a PHD subject), but their theories all make sense and should not be dismissed just because the Burgundians have refused to change anything for several hundred years...and as for the DRC's wines...I will say what I have always said, and believe unequivocally....when they get it right their wines are the greatest expressions of pinot noir in the world...but here is the hitch all their sycophants and apologists refuse to acknowledge...they produce an inordinate amount of fair to good wine rather than inspirational wine....and that seems to me a subject that can be addressed in a fair and responsible manner.....the open-minded folks out there should be reflecting upon the possibility that Turley/Wetlaufer may be correct.....and what is the significance of that? those that can take the opportunity should compare the Marcassin vineyard with any grand cru vineyard in Burgundy(say several weeks before harvest).....and decide for themselves which vineyard looks the healthiest, is rot and disease free,has the smallest berries and lowest yields per vine, has the most evenly ripened fruit,and the most pristine looking foliage....such factors are related to mother nature and terroir, but even more to the methods in which a vineyard is managed....you don't need to be an expert to see the remarkable differences...."
"I have known both John and Helen for over 20 years....intellectually, both are brilliant, and as well informed about viticulture in all its ramifications as anyone I have met with the possible exceptions of David Abreu,the Smiths at Saxum, and Manfred Krankl. They are also very reclusive, opinionated,and suffer no fools, but I have never seen them throw out outrageous ideas or shoot from the hip...their statements come from carefully considered and deep knowledge and research...they don't need to ridicule Burgundy's viticulture or the DRC to sell one bottle of their wine...they believe certain aspects of Burgundy's pruning, hedging, and trellising systems could be improved(this is a PHD subject), but their theories all make sense and should not be dismissed just because the Burgundians have refused to change anything for several hundred years...and as for the DRC's wines...I will say what I have always said, and believe unequivocally....when they get it right their wines are the greatest expressions of pinot noir in the world...but here is the hitch all their sycophants and apologists refuse to acknowledge...they produce an inordinate amount of fair to good wine rather than inspirational wine....and that seems to me a subject that can be addressed in a fair and responsible manner.....the open-minded folks out there should be reflecting upon the possibility that Turley/Wetlaufer may be correct.....and what is the significance of that? those that can take the opportunity should compare the Marcassin vineyard with any grand cru vineyard in Burgundy(say several weeks before harvest).....and decide for themselves which vineyard looks the healthiest, is rot and disease free,has the smallest berries and lowest yields per vine, has the most evenly ripened fruit,and the most pristine looking foliage....such factors are related to mother nature and terroir, but even more to the methods in which a vineyard is managed....you don't need to be an expert to see the remarkable differences...."
Florida Jim
Florida Jim
Decide for yourself.
That is pretty good advice.
Although the slant of his comments does seem to favor Marcassin.
And I will say that I have had DRC wines that have not impressed.
So I go back to "decide for yourself."
But neither of these producers is worth the money they demand.
Best, jim
That is pretty good advice.
Although the slant of his comments does seem to favor Marcassin.
And I will say that I have had DRC wines that have not impressed.
So I go back to "decide for yourself."
But neither of these producers is worth the money they demand.
Best, jim
Lou Kessler
Lou Kessler
Jim, both sell out easily each year. So whether they are not worth it to you and I is not relevant. The market says they are so it is. I've got a lot of wine in the store that sells well but I wouldn't drink it on a bet. If I could help it.
U
Unknown
Guest
the slant of CENSORED's comments favor planting pinot in provence. no rot, ripe berries, healthy vineyards... sure, the wines will be asshattedly banal at best, but never mind, eh, because that kind of shit is subjective. objectively, you'll have no rot, ripe berries, healthy vineyards and oodles of ooze.
once upon a time there was a concept in viticulture known as "marginal ripening," and it was considered to be of central importance when it came to the production of table-wines. a bunch of other stupid subjective concepts kept it company, things like over-ripeness, heat, natural acidity and balance.
then along came CENSORED and teh wine interwebs and "decide for yourself." and now we have mindless motherfuckers who are not content to peddle oak-drenched bullshit to the newby masses, but who also advocate the paving of paradise and the erection of a taylors refresher selling oozeburgers and mochafrappeoakshakes on the rn 74, just to show the hicks in the old world what real culture is. and, of course, we have that wank stain CENSORED calling them "intellectuals" because these cats need each other like bernie madoff needed jeffry picower needed the rubes born every minute.
never mind, eh? it's all subjective, so "decide for yourself." fiscal policy? "decide for yourself." evolution? "decide for yourself." ill advised foreign adventures dropping fridges full of cash on towel headed babies? "decide for yourself."
97 fucking points! or else a minimalist double prong fashioned from raffia and decorated with roderick spode brown shorts? yah, "decide for yourself."
fb.
Except for the 'towel headed' comment, fatboy makes a lot of sense.
Not to mention the fact that having an informed opinion on DRC wines is a pretty severe marker of distinction in these days and times and not exactly easy to come by. You can't just ask people to go out and decide for themselves the most comfortable way to travel to the moon either.
Not to mention the fact that having an informed opinion on DRC wines is a pretty severe marker of distinction in these days and times and not exactly easy to come by. You can't just ask people to go out and decide for themselves the most comfortable way to travel to the moon either.
Ian Fitzsimmons
Ian Fitzsimmons
For heaven's sake, I was spoofing Kermit's reply to Disorder, when folks were giving him grief about putting his name on front labels. 'Making [me] your devil' was the memorable signature phrase.
Jeff Grossman
Jeff Grossman
Is that what a critic is supposed to say? Doesn't that put him out of a job?