Impressions

[Jonathan Loesberg]

It's hard to say which is lamer, your original remark or this hilariously ill-tempered response. The lack of commas around the phrase "who can't taste anymore" makes the clause non-restrictive and thus claims that all grandmothers can't taste anymore. I'm guessing that was an accident. By adding the commas back in, however, you naturally raise the question of why you chose that category as opposed to grandfathers, grandchildren, retired professors of literature, rabbits, or, your likely real meaning, anyone who happens to disagree with you.

 

[Jim Hanlon]

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:

originally posted by Larry Stein:
Lenoir allocation? Hell, I haven't seen any vintages more recent than '07 on the market.

Cory, Jim, Guillaume... what's the news from Lenoir?

Pretty sure 2007 is the current release for Lenoir. Selection Massale is still bringing the wines in.

 

[Marc D]

originally posted by Jim Hanlon:

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:

originally posted by Larry Stein:
Lenoir allocation? Hell, I haven't seen any vintages more recent than '07 on the market.

Cory, Jim, Guillaume... what's the news from Lenoir?

Pretty sure 2007 is the current release for Lenoir. Selection Massale is still bringing the wines in.

Old school Chinon. I love their wine.

 

[slaton]

originally posted by Jim Hanlon:
Jim, I have some 1999 and 2001 Ar.Pe.Pe. Riservas. Next time you're in northern California, let's organize an offline in the East Bay and we can open them.

Sounds fun! I have a 2001 Grumello Riserva 'Buon Consiglio' or a 2006 Sassella Stella Retica Riserva I'd be happy to contribute.

 

[Ian Fitzsimmons]

Just opened an 06 Stella Retica in October - very nice, but, imho, still youthful, brash. I'm intruiged by this producer and would love to read the notes from this off-line.

 

[Jim Hanlon]

originally posted by slaton:

originally posted by Jim Hanlon:
Jim, I have some 1999 and 2001 Ar.Pe.Pe. Riservas. Next time you're in northern California, let's organize an offline in the East Bay and we can open them.

Sounds fun! I have a 2001 Grumello Riserva 'Buon Consiglio' or a 2006 Sassella Stella Retica Riserva I'd be happy to contribute.

Slaton, let's one of us remember to make this happen in June or July.

 

[Larry Stein]

I don't have any wines from Ar.Pe.Pe to contribute, but I'd like to attend. I'm sure I can find an appropriate wine to bring.

 

[Karen Goetz]

originally posted by Levi Dalton:

originally posted by Karen Goetz:
DUH

originally posted by Levi Dalton:

originally posted by Karen Goetz:

originally posted by Levi Dalton:

originally posted by Todd Abrams:
What do you mean when you say better?

I mean, in my personal opinion, Fay is lame wine, and stylized point fodder polished over for people who don't like Nebbiolo, grandmothers who can't taste anymore, and tourists, while Ar. Pe. Pe. is one of the real gems of the region, capable of true greatness.

If I am beating around the bush too much in my explanation, let me know and I'll try to be more clear.

Having said that, it is true that going around the Valtellina talking with producers, I found more producers who admired Fay than admired Ar. Pe. Pe. But it is also true that if you go around Santorini, you don't find other producers saying how wonderful Canava Roussos is, and I believe it truly is wonderful.

Grandmothers who can't taste anymore is more than a bit lame! Update to the next century, please.

If you visit the Valtellina, you may in fact notice that local pensioners and visiting European tourists are both significant market segments for the wines. For example, I spoke with one producer who specifically makes Sforzato for the tourists who often request it, while he himself does not care for the category. And as in the Alto Piemonte, there is an aging local population in the Valtellina that drinks a lot of wine per capita. I assume that you are unaware of this, but maybe not. Anyway, I was in the Valtellina last year, which I believe is safely within this century.

Your visit may have been to Valtellina in the last century but your perspective is antediluvian.
Usually I like your writing about wines. It is your reference to "Grandmothers", you dope, that I am suggesting is Old School in the (perhaps on your part ignorant, blasé, or unintentionally pejorative) worst sense of the word. DUH. Surely you jest in discriminating so sloppily about who is "...the significant market segments for the wines." Are these markets that offend you so much composed of waves of old women indiscriminately buying wines for their incapacitated husbands, really? Wouldn't it be awful if their tastebuds were significantly superior to your own? (Joke). You know of course about the relative superiority of women's palates... such a generalization, shocking, I know.
I guess I'm disappointed by your generalizations, given your wonderful experience with wines and wine regions.

Karen,

Are you thinking that perhaps grandmothers aren't drinking wine anymore, or that no one should speak of them as a market, or that tasting acuity doesn't decline with age? Or perhaps some combination of these toughts?

At any rate feel free to take your supposed rage elsewhere. What I said is perfectly accurate and defensible.

My wonderful experience with wine and wine regions is something I have earned through work and persistence. I didn't get it by trying to censor people's speech, either (DUH!).

Levi,
"... I'll huff, and I'll puff, and I'll blow your house down..." NOT.
I feel sorry for you, Dude. Wine region history and tasting experience just doesn't fill the gap, does it?

 

[Karen Goetz]

originally posted by Jonathan Loesberg:
It's hard to say which is lamer, your original remark or this hilariously ill-tempered response. The lack of commas around the phrase "who can't taste anymore" makes the clause non-restrictive and thus claims that all grandmothers can't taste anymore. I'm guessing that was an accident. By adding the commas back in, however, you naturally raise the question of why you chose that category as opposed to grandfathers, grandchildren, retired professors of literature, rabbits, or, your likely real meaning, anyone who happens to disagree with you.

What a great guy. Not personal, really, but I like your readiness to call things for what they are, Jonathan! Wine being what it is, outside of the prejudices, avarice and rabid insecurities we may occasionally bring to the table.
2015 Guion Domaine Bourgeuil at this table, lovely and new but a puzzling hint of VA that distracts from the red berry and black bark delights of the moment. New delivery, hoping for resolution.

 

[Jonathan Loesberg]

Yes, but as I read you quoting me, I find a made a pedestrian grammatical error. The absence of commas makes the clause restrictive--non-restrictive clauses are set off by commas. Thus Levi did not even accidentally mean that all grandmothers can't taste anymore (or at least what he wrote didn't) and the intended meaning--still a lame one--that I spoke about was also the written meaning. I'm surprised Jeff or Sharon didn't catch me out on this. Mea culpa.

 

[Sharon Bowman]

Sorry, I couldn't see what you'd written, through my flame-retardant suit.

 

[Jeff Grossman]

Jeff has a mouthful of popcorn.

 

[Todd Abrams]

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Jeff has a mouthful of popcorn.

Speaking of popcorn, I'm getting a little tired of my usual popcorn flavorings of butter and hot sauce or olive oil and rosemary. Any suggestions for popcorn exploration?

 

[Marc D]

originally posted by Todd Abrams:

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Jeff has a mouthful of popcorn.

Speaking of popcorn, I'm getting a little tired of my usual popcorn flavorings of butter and hot sauce or olive oil and rosemary. Any suggestions for popcorn exploration?

Butter and brewers yeast. The flaked kind, not the powder. It's very addictive.

 

[Todd Abrams]

originally posted by Marc D:

originally posted by Todd Abrams:

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Jeff has a mouthful of popcorn.

Speaking of popcorn, I'm getting a little tired of my usual popcorn flavorings of butter and hot sauce or olive oil and rosemary. Any suggestions for popcorn exploration?

Butter and brewers yeast. The flaked kind, not the powder. It's very addictive.

Is brewer's yeast different than nutritional yeast? Because I've tried nutritional yeast on my popcorn and was not enamored, to say the least.

 

[Marc D]

It may be the same thing, not certain. It is a strong flavor, not for everyone.

 

[Todd Abrams]

originally posted by Marc D:
It may be the same thing, not certain. It is a strong flavor, not for everyone.

I think it's similar to vegemite, of which I only know thanks to Men at Work.

 

[Jay Miller]

originally posted by Todd Abrams:

originally posted by Jeff Grossman:
Jeff has a mouthful of popcorn.

Speaking of popcorn, I'm getting a little tired of my usual popcorn flavorings of butter and hot sauce or olive oil and rosemary. Any suggestions for popcorn exploration?

Sichuan Peppercorns. IIRC I learned that one from Keith. Unfortunately Arnold seems to be allergic

 

[Jeff Grossman]

Fennel pollen.

 

[Kay Bixler]

Best thread ever. It's all here, grammar, conflict, fennel pollen, even wine.

Anyone (Jeff) have a favorite recording of Bach's Mass in B minor?

Really kind of hooked on this one.